American Pale Ale [Archive] - Realbeer.com Beer Community

the4th

06-15-2004, 11:52 AM

Boiled this on up on Sunday. I'll let you know what it tastes like in month or so.
-----

1/2 lb. domestic two-row pale malt
1/2 lb. Cara-pils malt

Steep grains, remove just before boil. (I did mine in 3 gallons of water from flame on until 175 degrees, then let the bag drain out w/out squeezing or sparging it.)

Add:
6 lbs. light unhopped malt extract and bring to a boil.

Once boil starts, add:

60 Minutes:
1/2 oz Perle
1/2 oz Cascade

30 minutes:
1/2 oz Mt Hood
1/2 oz Crystal
1/4 oz Perle

20 minutes:
3/4 teaspoon of irish moss (rehydrated in 1/4 cup of water)

15 minutes:
1/4 oz Cascade
1/4 oz Crystal
1/4 oz Perle

Flame out:
1/4 oz Cascade
1/2 oz Mt Hood
1/4 oz Crystal

I cooled the wort. Dumped it into the primary, topped it off to about 5.5 gallons w/ cold water, and pitched my yeast.

The original recipe called for 1 pkg. Nottingham ale yeast, Wyeast #1056, #1007, or White Labs California or German ale yeast. I didn't have any of them, so I used the tried and true gold package of Coopers ale yeast which I made a small starter with about 5 hours in advance. Fermentation was incredibly fast. I'll rack it in the secondary sometime later this week or on the weekend.

Expected O.G. - 1.047 (Didn't bother checking.)
Expected F.G. - 1.011 (Didn't bother checking.)
-----

Racked this to the secondary on Wednesday night. On Sunday I added 1 ounce of Crystal (pellets) to the secondary. Now I'm waiting for it to clear again.

DONE! Kegged on Saturday. VERY Hoppy and grapefruity. Kind of disappointed in the amount of grapefruit flavor. I was hoping for less. (Which is why I don't use Amarillo or lots of Cascade. I guess since Crystal is a hybrid of Cascade, it still carries similar flavor.... oh well... live and learn.) Still very drinkable version of a hoppy American brew. My hop-head friends love it.

BrewDog

09-26-2004, 11:16 PM

Here's what I made today:

Mt Si APA

5 Gal batch:

1 1/2 tsp Gypsum
9 1/2 lbs Domestic Two Row Pale Malt
1 lb flaked wheat
3/4 lb CaraPils
1/2 lb Crystal 60L
1/4 lb Crystal 40L
1/2 lb Aromatic malt
1/2 lb Victory malt

(all hops whole leaf)
1 oz 8.6% Amarillo @ boil
1 oz 5.6% Cascade @ 30
1 oz 5.6% Cascade @ 20
1 oz 5.6% Cascade @ 5

Repitched WLP001

Mash 3.5 gals 15 mins @148
Step up Add 1gal - 15 mins @ 154
Batch Sparge 165

1 wk primary @ 68 then
3 wks secondary (1 oz Cascade in 1 pint Hop Tea)

Prime with 3/4 cups corn sugar & bottle

axis714

11-12-2004, 11:50 PM

This 1 started as a Czech Pilsner changed to a northern German pilsner...and Ive decided now its an American Pilsner w/ German influence.

Beer: International Pilsener Style: American Pilsener
Type: Extract w/grain Size: 5 gallons
Color: 7 HCU (~5 SRM)
Bitterness: 30 IBU
OG: 1.057 FG: 1.008
Alcohol: 5.7%

Grain 2# german Pilsner
6 lb. canadian extra Light malt extract
1 lb. Rice syrup extract
Hops: 1 oz. Hallertauer (4.25% AA, 60 min.)
1 oz. Hallertauer (4.25% AA, 45 min.)
1 oz. Saaz (3.75% AA, 30 min.)
1 oz. Saaz (3.75% AA, 5 min.)

steep grains for 45 mins @ 165 -sparge -with 1 liter @170 add 1 0z hallertau and boil 15 mins add the light malt and rice extract and 1 more ounce hallertau(leaf) I added the saaz @ 30 & 5 and used Wyeast 2278 Czech Pilsner yeast in the new and improved 125 ml XL activator smack pack. Primary ferment 1 week @65 deg secondary ferment 3 weeks @ 55 deg primed with a very small amount of corn sugar maybe 1/4 cup in 1 cup h2o....TAD bottled the whole batch and cold conditioned for 1 week.
This is 1 of the finest extract w/grain light lagers Ive made I think its the weissheimer pils malt flavor Im getting also the Canadian malt seems to have finished out very dry...the hops are just right with a great saaz aroma.

burritosandbeer

11-15-2004, 10:12 AM

Emilys Amber

for 5 gallons
6lbs light Liquid malt extract
1.5lbs 10l crystal
1.5oz cascade for 60 min
.5oz cascade (half at 5 min left, half at flame out)

White labs american ale yeast (or i usually culture sierra nevada pale yeast)

very yummy, cloudy, easy to drink amber, perfect for late spring, or early summer, or late summer early fall :-)

CampAjohn

03-04-2005, 11:09 AM

This is pretty much the 5gal. full grain version from the Mar-April 2002 Replicator. Here is the recipe I used, boosting the hops to a full oz. of Cascade in the boil:

9# Pale American 2-row
1# Munich
.5# 80L Crystal malt
.5# Carapils (dextrin) malt
1oz. Centennial hops @ 60 min.
1oz. Cacade @ 15 min.
1 oz. Cascade @ 0 min. (during cool down)
1 tsp. Irish moss @ 15 min.
Wyeast 1098 British Ale
1.25 cups Amber DME for bottling
.5oz. Cascade pellets in secondary for 4 days

Single step 155F mash for 60 min., 2 step sparge with 180F water, 60 min. boil.

OG=1.060, FG=1.016
ABV=5.5pct.

This is a nicely balanced Amber. Medium strong maltiness matched by assertive but not overpowering (by NW standards!)
hops. Fairly dry finish, and not so much alcohol that you can't have two at a sitting.

Otis_The_Drunk

01-09-2006, 07:36 PM

5 Gallons All-Grain

Grain
8 lb 2-row
1/2 lb crystal 10L

Hops
1 oz Kent Golding (60 min)
1/2 oz Fuggles (60 min)
1/2 oz Fuggles (15 min)
1 oz Saaz (5 min)

other

1 whirlfloc tablet (15 min)

Yeast
White Labs - East Coast Ale
or
Wyeast - American Ale II 1272

Mash using single step infusion
Mash @ 154 * for 1 hour or until it passes the iodine test.

OG 1.045
FG 1.012

HogieWan

01-10-2006, 01:48 PM

Originally posted by Otis_The_Drunk
Austin Homebrew Supply, I have made it before and it comes in just about spot on.

I've made two of their kits (1 extract and 1 AG) and have been happy with the results

Otis_The_Drunk

01-10-2006, 02:49 PM

Yeah I used to use Lubbock Homebrew Supply, but sadly they went under. I guess there wasn't enough college kids interested in learning how to brew.

After that I started using AHS and have been pleased with both their service and some of their kits as well. I have since been having them make up my recipes as well as buying some of their kits.

I do buy things from other online HBS most notably Northern Brewer and have been pleased with them as well.

Right now since I got back into all-grain brewing I'm still trying to figure out what my house brew is going to be.

Also at the time I bought this kit, I had them put together my own porter recipe and decided to try out their version of Anchor Steam.

Over the last year I was stuck on making Belgian dubles and triples and finally reached one that was perfect for me.
After I figure out my house brew, I think I may concentrate on making the definitive Altbier or Kolsch.

I generally pick out one style a year and keep tweeking it until I can make it the best it can possibly be. some styles are easier than others.

msk

04-30-2006, 10:49 AM

I went to the store and had 10 # of 2 row on my list, but for some reason I came home with 6 # 2 row and 2 # of each of the munich and crystal . . . so it looks a little light on fermentables. I styled it after the Michigan Brewing Company's Pale that I tasted a sample of 3 weeks ago, though I have only the "what is on tap" information that they post on their web site to formulate my recepie.

6# 2-row
2# munich
1# carapils
1# crystal 60

Mashed 150 degrees F for 90 minutes
7 gallons into the boil, 6 galons out

1 oz Fuggles whole 5.2 AA
1 oz Cascade whole 7 AA

Applied 1/2 oz of each hop at 50 and at 10 minutes. I think this was better than what I originally intended, which was the Cascade at flameout. It was 3am and I was just not in the mood any more.

OG 1.034

Safbrew 33

Notes:
I batch sparged in my bottling bucket and went too fast, dumping 5 gallons on it all at once. I should have broken it down into two sparges of half the amount because I then sparged again to get a base for my upcoming stout's water, just to give it a little boost, and the OG on that came out at 1.014. Bummer on the stupidity, but good for the education.

I took a hydrometer reading as I was seeing if it was ready to move to the secondary [the airlock stopped moving, turned out that it was just gummed up, but I was in so I took the sample]. It was a little more gold-orange than the MBC's red-brown product, so next time I think some crystal 40 and crystal 120 would be better than just crystal 60. . . but it tasted pretty nice, even though there was yeast sediment by the time I hit the bottom of the hydrometer sampling.

thekulman

07-05-2006, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by Otis_The_Drunk
5 Gallons All-Grain

Grain
8 lb 2-row
1/2 lb crystal 10L

Hops
1 oz Kent Golding (60 min)
1/2 oz Fuggles (60 min)
1/2 oz Fuggles (15 min)
1 oz Saaz (5 min)

Otis, this looks like a good recipe (your Sam Adams Clone) how did it turn out?

mookow

07-13-2006, 12:05 AM

I sampled some of this today with a couple brewer's from Great Lakes (I was there to pick up some yeast slurry), and one of them thought it was very similar to Burning River (their APA), the other shook my hand and said he thought it was actually better than Burning River and easily one of the best homebrews he has ever tasted. I'm pretty happy with this, but will try fiddling with it to tweek it just a bit. I'm going to continue sparging and boiling a little more to get my efficiency a bit higher (and thus my OG) and probably mash higher. This time I mashed at 150F, next time it will be at 151F because it's just a tiny bit too thin for my tastes.

04-23-2006 Baby Seal Brewery APA #1
A ProMash Brewing Session Report
--------------------------------

Brewing Date: Sunday April 23, 2006
Head Brewer: Tim "Timmmahhhhh" Hayes
Asst Brewer:
Recipe: Baby Seal Brewery APA #1

Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (Gal): 5.00 Wort Size (Gal): 5.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 11.50
Anticipated OG: 1.048 Plato: 11.87
Anticipated SRM: 9.1
Anticipated IBU: 52.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 57 %
Wort Boil Time: 75 Minutes

Actual OG: 1.048 Plato: 11.91
Actual FG: 1.007 Plato: 1.80

Alc by Weight: 4.23 by Volume: 5.39 From Measured Gravities.
ADF: 84.9 RDF 70.3 Apparent & Real Degree of Fermentation.

Actual Mash System Efficiency: 61 %
Anticipated Points From Mash: 47.82
Actual Points From Mash: 51.23

Grain/Extract/Sugar
% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
65.2 7.50 lbs. Maris Otter England 1.037 3
8.7 1.00 lbs. Crystal 10L America 1.035 10
8.7 1.00 lbs. Munich Malt(2-row) America 1.035 10
8.7 1.00 lbs. Victory Malt America 1.034 25
8.7 1.00 lbs. Wheat Malt America 1.038 2

Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
0.25 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 10.0 First WH
0.25 oz. Chinook Pellet 12.00 14.2 First WH
1.00 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.75 9.5 20 min.
0.75 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 10.6 20 min.
0.50 oz. Ahtanum Pellet 6.00 5.0 20 min.
0.50 oz. Willamette Whole 4.40 3.3 20 min.
0.25 oz. Ahtanum Pellet 6.00 0.0 0 min.
0.50 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.75 0.0 0 min.
0.25 oz. Willamette Whole 5.00 0.0 0 min.
0.50 oz. Centennial Pellet 10.50 0.0 0 min.
0.75 oz. Centennial Pellet 10.50 0.0 Dry Hop
0.25 oz. Ahtanum Pellet 6.00 0.0 Dry Hop
0.50 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.75 0.0 Dry Hop
0.25 oz. Willamette Whole 5.00 0.0 Dry Hop
0.25 oz. Chinook Pellet 13.00 0.0 Dry Hop

Extras
Amount Name Type Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.00 Unit(s)Whirlfloc Fining 10 Min.(boil)

Yeast
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WYeast 1028 London Ale

SoxyinMO

10-29-2006, 08:56 AM

Brewzhound Brewing presents : a SoxyinMo production

Shockley Bottom APA

Brewed on: Friday, 29 Sept. 2006
Racked to 2ndary: Monday, 9 Oct. 2006
Bottled on : Friday 27 Oct. 2006

Important stuff :

HCU : 19 (~11 SRM)
IBU : 45
OG : 1.062 @ 15° C
FG : 1.012 @ 15° C

Into 5 gallons of cool water went a bag containing:

1 lb. 8 oz. American victory
4 oz. American crystal (20L)
2 oz. American crystal (60L)
2 oz. Belgian CaraVienne

The water temp. was raised to 160° F and the grains allowed to rest there for 20 minutes. The water temp. then went to 168° and the grains were removed.

At the boil was added :

5 lb. 4 oz. Light dry malt extract
4 oz. Amber dry malt extract
1 lb. Granulated honey

At 45 minutes into the boil I added 1 t. Irish Moss

The hops pellets were added so:

.50oz. Chinook (60 min.)
.25 oz. Mt. Hood (60 min.)
.25 oz. Cascade (45 min.)
.50 oz. Cluster (45 min.)
.50 oz. Cluster (15 min.)
.75 oz. Cascade (flameout)
.75 oz. Cluster (flameout)

I used WYeast's American Ale yeast

At bottling this two-tone American Pale ale has a light malty flavor in a medium mouth-feel with a nip of citrus at the end. I'm looking forward to seeing if the honey makes its presence known.

markaberrant

10-29-2006, 09:51 AM

Originally posted by SoxyinMO
Brewzhound Brewing presents : a SoxyinMo production

At bottling this two-tone American Pale ale has a light malty flavor in a medium mouth-feel with a nip of citrus at the end. I'm looking forward to seeing if the honey makes its presence known.

I'm guessing the honey will do nothing but thin out and dry out the beer. When you add it for the full boil, that's about all you are going to get.

I haven't really experimented with honey, but if/when I do, I will add it to the primary once fermentation slows.

sittingcow

05-16-2007, 10:31 AM

This is the first beer I've brewed that I actually designed the recipe for, and I am indescribably pleased! This is what I did... feel free to offer criticism or brew your own version completely differently.

Hi-How-Are-Ya American Ale

Mini-mash for 60 min. @ 152 degrees (or so)
8 oz. 2-row
8 oz. Crystal 60L
8 oz. Carapils

6 lbs. Pale DME

(60) Northern Brewer, 1 oz.
(60) Nugget, 1 oz.
(15) Amarillo, 1.5 oz.
(0) Amarillo, 0.5 oz.

WLP001 California Ale
Primary @ 68-70 deg., 14 days
Bottles @ 72 deg., 14 days (1 cup DME primer)
Bottles @ 55 deg. until ready to consume

1.047 -> 1.011 = ~4.5-5% ABV

A spicy flowery grapefruit aroma cuts in front of a lightly sweet malt backbone. Very, very, very drinkable and delicious. Maybe cut a little back on the bittering if you don't like a dry finish. It's not very clear - use Irish moss or a secondary if you'd like (it is a beautiful color, so clarity would be nice). This is a great one for impatient people - it was practically at its peak flavor after 1 week in the bottles!

Powhatan

05-31-2007, 10:34 PM

Here's what I'm brewing up on Sat:

American Ale

12# 2-row
0.75# carapils

1 oz Amarillo @ boil 8%
1 oz Cascade @ 20 min
1 oz Cascade @ 5 min

yeast - haven't decided yet... east coast/english... hmmm... american i think (whitelabs)

Target OG 1.054
5.5 gal

One question though... what's the diff between 2-row and pale ale aside from color? I like lighter stuff myself.

thekulman

06-03-2007, 01:21 PM

Originally posted by sittingcow

Mini-mash for 60 min. @ 152 degrees (or so)
8 oz. 2-row
8 oz. Crystal 60L
8 oz. Carapils

Hi, my only criticque - and it won't change the flavour of your beer, would be to exclude the 2-row. 1/2 lb of 2-row is only going to give you 3-4 gravity points in a 19 l (5 gal) batch.

You're not really mini-mashing because the Crystal has undergone a "mash" in the shell already and I don't think the amount of enzymes present in 8 oz of 2-row, would be enough to mash it as well as an equal weight of Carapils (which must be mashed in the presents of enzymes supplied by another grain since it lacks it's own).

What you've really achieved is to extract the flavour and goodness from those grains but not really mash them.

But the recipe looks good and sounds like it turned out great!

So Cheers and Happy Brewing!

Kul

SRFeldman79

10-19-2007, 11:23 AM

Made this beer on Labor Day weekend.

4 lbs alexander's pale
3.3 briesse amber
.5 lbs 50-60 deg. crystal
.5 lbs 20 caramel
2 oz chinook bitter
1 oz chinook/1 oz amarillo with 10 minutes left
1 oz amarillo/1 oz cascade with about 90 seconds left

used california ale yeast from white labs.

OG was about 1049
FG was 1011 about
final color is about right for a pale ale. the caramel grains came through in the final flavor, perhaps more than i wanted, and instead of the chinook at flavoring hops time, i think i should have done all amarillo.
very drinkable beer and only the third ive made.

thekulman

08-05-2008, 11:01 AM

I brewed a hoppy American P.A. yesterday - it should be a hop bomb! Looking forward to it.

4.4 lbs Marris Otter
5 lbs 2 Row
0.6 lbs Crystal 80L
1 lb corn meal

Started mash at 158F, was 152 after the hour.

0.5 oz Centennial 8% 60 min
1 oz Centennial 8% 30 min
1 oz Cascade 4.9 % 15 min
1 oz Cascade 4.9 % 5 min

Wyeast 1056 American Ale (Chico)

21 liters to primary (5.5 gallons)
O.G. 1.044
IBU's = 45.7

I'm thinking of adding another 0.5 - 1oz cascade in the seconday as a dry hop.
Any feedback or advise?

Brian
www.homebrewersretail.com

steveh

08-05-2008, 11:05 AM

Corn meal? Yuck.

S.

Otis_The_Drunk

08-05-2008, 11:07 AM

Corn Meal? What the Hell for?

steveh

08-05-2008, 11:33 AM

C'mon Otis -- dig into that U.S. brewing history: lighter body, more fermentables... bigger hangover...

S.

Mad Scientist

08-05-2008, 12:05 PM

Hey! Layoff, after brewing for 21 years, I am sure he knows what he likes.

markaberrant

08-05-2008, 12:26 PM

With that low a gravity, you probably don't need the dry hops... but they wouldn't hurt either.

thekulman

08-05-2008, 12:53 PM

Lol! Yeah, corn meal.

I've been wanting to try it for a while to lighten the body. I've used a pound of rice before (boiling it in lots of water for 30 min. first to gelatinize it) and the results were fine.
Using up to 20% adjuncts to lighten the body should, theoretically, cause no discernable change in taste from an all malt beer - just lighter body. With the corn meal I'm only at 10%. It will be fine.
I'm going for something with the mouth feel of say a Molson Canadian, but the flavour of an all malt beer.

Brian

steveh

08-05-2008, 01:17 PM

I'm going for something with the mouth feel of say a Molson Canadian,

You're on the right track...

MS -- one of my brew-pub brewmaster friends used to make a Cream Ale that utilized 30% (IIRC) corn. It was very light, very drinkable -- and too much could give you a head the size of Wisconsin the day after.

Besides, the recipes here are being thrown out for critique as much as anything else, so I repeat: Corn meal? Yuck.

S.

thekulman

08-05-2008, 04:03 PM

You're on the right track...
Besides, the recipes here are being thrown out for critique as much as anything else, so I repeat: Corn meal? Yuck.S.

Absolutely, and no offence taken. I'll let you know what it tastes like. I'm assuming the effect on the taste will be neutral. But I've never used it.
And your understanding is that the more adjunct used the worse the hangover?

I was speaking to a craft brewer here in Ontario who makes Denison's Wheat beer - the highest rated Bavarian Weiss and in the top 5 overall beer ratings on 'ratebeer.com'.
Any way, he used to be an engineer at Molson's in Toronto. He was telling me about the massive Cereal Cookers they have and said that in that high production professional enviornment they can use up to 60% sugars derived from cereals (Typically corn in Canada. In the US your big boys use mainly rice I've heard) in their beers! Can you imagine that?

Brian
www.homebrewersretail.com

steveh

08-05-2008, 04:05 PM

And your understanding is that the more adjunct used the worse the hangover?

Can only speak to my own experience, but yeah -- that Cream Ale was a killer. Pub-brewed too.

S.

beerking

08-05-2008, 04:23 PM

Any way, he used to be an engineer at Molson's in Toronto. He was telling me about the massive Cereal Cookers they have and said that in that high production professional enviornment they can use up to 60% sugars derived from cereals (Typically corn in Canada. In the US your big boys use mainly rice I've heard) in their beers! Can you imagine that?

My personal opinion: YUCK!!!
No wonder I never liked Molson!

OBTW, he may think "they can" use that much, but I, for one, can taste it. And yes, it does increase a hangover.

steveh

08-05-2008, 05:21 PM

In the US your big boys use mainly rice I've heard) in their beers!

Nah, only Budweiser. All the rest (Busch included) are corn adjunct beers. And you can definitely taste it in the likes of a Miller.

S.

Mad Scientist

08-05-2008, 06:02 PM

Nah, only Budweiser. All the rest (Busch included) are corn adjunct beers. And you can definitely taste it in the likes of a Miller.

S.

Coors uses rice also. I believe it was hogie that corrected me on this subject.

markaberrant

08-05-2008, 06:07 PM

Bud and Coors both taste "cleaner" than Miller. I have always assumed they both use rice, whereas Miller unmistakably uses corn.

Mad Scientist

08-05-2008, 06:27 PM

Corney bastards.....

Mill Rat

08-05-2008, 07:48 PM

Typically corn in Canada. In the US your big boys use mainly rice I've heard Actually kul, corn (maize) is also the adjunct of choice for most macro-brews "pilsners" in the states, too, with the exception of A-B's Bud, which was probably conflated into representing all US macro-brews. Corn was originally used because it was the cheapest, blandest source of convertible starch to cut down on the heavy protein body that would result from using 100% of the native 6-row barley, as opposed to the lower-protein 2-row barley found in Europe.

beerking

08-05-2008, 09:09 PM

Before they went all-malt, Michelob used rice also. Generally, in the US the "super-premium beers" (what an oxy-moron) use rice and the premium beers use corn.

dparsons

08-05-2008, 10:25 PM

So let me get this straight (playing devil's advocate):

Barely, Wheat, Oats, Rye = good

Corn, Rice = bad

What about Sake?

Mad Scientist

08-05-2008, 10:51 PM

What about Sake?

Bad.... :D

steveh

08-06-2008, 08:12 AM

Coors uses rice also. I believe it was hogie that corrected me on this subject.

You guys sure? Coors never gave me that spike-thru-the-head after a first sip headache that Bud would. Maybe just not as much rice as Bud.

Not much clear from the web site:
MillerCoors primarily uses special varieties of barley with excellent consistency for brewing purposes. Other cereal grains—corn, wheat or rice—can be used with barley as “adjuncts.” Corn, for example, gives beer a milder, lighter-bodied flavor.

But it's interesting that they explain adjuncts (wheat?), but focus on the corn.

King -- I wasn't sure on old Mich, I'd thought they stayed away from the rice in order to give it a little more body.

S.

steveh

08-06-2008, 08:14 AM

Bud and Coors both taste "cleaner" than Miller.

Aren't two of the three brewed in-country for Canada? Maybe a different recipe?

Then again, why are we even debating this -- BMC = waste of time.

Oh yeah, Sake too -- yech.

S.

beerking

08-06-2008, 08:50 AM

You guys sure? Coors never gave me that spike-thru-the-head after a first sip headache that Bud would. Maybe just not as much rice as Bud.

Not much clear from the web site:

But it's interesting that they explain adjuncts (wheat?), but focus on the corn.

King -- I wasn't sure on old Mich, I'd thought they stayed away from the rice in order to give it a little more body.

S.

Steve,

I remember touring Golden in the late 80s where our Vanna-esque tour guide was discussing the ingredients in Coors, she explained that the rice gave the beer "its drinkability."
I also was told by one of the Asst Brewers at the A-B plant in Williamsburg (again, late 80s) that they used corn in all the beers except Bud and Mich, which used rice. Pretty cool guy, he was actually a member of our homebrew club, and got us all an insider's tour. We got to walk inside the glass that everyone else looks through. Best part was the hands on tour of the hop storage warehouse!
Also, the instant headache from Bud is most likely from the poor yeast they use, and acetylaldehyde they intentionally allow (gives the beer a bit more "crispness." in reality, that is why it tastes so awful if above 40F). The poor yeast is pretty well known throughout the industry, and that is why they use the beechwood. Without it the yeast would not properly ferment the beer at all.

beerking

08-06-2008, 08:54 AM

So let me get this straight (playing devil's advocate):

Barely, Wheat, Oats, Rye = good

Corn, Rice = bad

What about Sake?

I like Sake, but only in small quantities, and only the really premium stuff. The best Sake is actually served cold. Only the cheap stuff is served warm. If you have not tried really high quality Sake, you should give it a shot, with someone who knows the good stuff.

steveh

08-06-2008, 09:05 AM

I remember touring Golden in the late 80s where our Vanna-esque tour guide was discussing the ingredients in Coors, she explained that the rice gave the beer "its drinkability."

I took the same tour in 2000 (not sure it was the same guide, though I rarely take anything they say seriously) and there was no mention of rice use in their beers.

But I'll repeat, why waste time debating this anyway, I can't remember the last BM or C I had.

Also, the instant headache from Bud is most likely from the poor yeast they use

Well, I doubt the home-brew Bud clone I judged had access to the A-B yeast, and Capital's Wild Rice beer, from a few years back, almost assuredly didn't use an A-B yeast, yet they both gave me the "instant hangover." I think I have an allergy to malted rice.

S.

markaberrant

08-06-2008, 10:29 AM

Aren't two of the three brewed in-country for Canada? Maybe a different recipe?

Then again, why are we even debating this -- BMC = waste of time.

Oh yeah, Sake too -- yech.

S.

We only get MGD and Bud up here (along with Bud Light and Coors Light) - the Bud is made here, I think we get a mix of imported and Canadian brewed MGD... but like you say, I really don't care. However, I was basing my opinions on the US versions, though it has been awhile since I've sampled any of them.

dparsons

08-11-2008, 01:53 AM

Oh yeah, Sake too -- yech.

S.

I suppose you'd turn your nose up at a good plum wine too! :eek:

steveh

08-11-2008, 08:16 AM

I suppose you'd turn your nose up at a good plum wine too!

Actually, I enjoy plumb wine with Chinese fare once in a while, but it's not made of rice. But good, German, plumb schnaaps is a much more enjoyable drink (please try to remember that German schnaaps and U.S. schnaaps are not akin).

S.

beerking

08-11-2008, 09:24 AM

Have you tried hops schnaaps? Very strong stuff, but good.

steveh

08-11-2008, 09:44 AM

Have you tried hops schnaaps?

No, where did you have it? Many of the Brauereigasthause in Germany have Bierschnapps -- pretty much distilled down Doppelbock, that is very good, but I enjoy the fermented/distilled fruit styles more.

S.

steveh

08-11-2008, 09:46 AM

Ever tried this? http://www.stroh.co.uk/stroh/start.htm

Supposed to be the big deal in Austria... tastes like creosote or roofing tar.

S.

beerking

08-11-2008, 10:00 AM

Nope. Never heard of it. Sounds like something to avoid.

steveh

08-11-2008, 10:07 AM

I think I saw it in a small store in the Austrian Alps, bought a bottle for hiking (the Stroh name struck a chord), tried a sip at the first stop and about choked.

I smuggled it home and an old brewmaster friend liked it a lot (Dave Norton, King) so he became keeper of the Stroh.

S.

JayShaw91

01-12-2009, 05:19 PM

Back to discussing the beer style... and resurrecting this thread :)

Anyone have a guide for the BU:GU ratio for the Amber version? Ray Daniel's book doesn't include ambers... just pale ales.

corkybstewart

01-12-2009, 05:43 PM

No, where did you have it? Many of the Brauereigasthause in Germany have Bierschnapps -- pretty much distilled down Doppelbock, that is very good, but I enjoy the fermented/distilled fruit styles more.

S.
The day you posted this I was in fact having a Bierschnapps in Germany at the brauereigasthause in Zuzenhausen near Heidleburg. Their schnapps was much more of a spirit-very strong with no beer flavor. I did bring back several bottles of the bierschnapps from Hotel Lowenbrau in Bad Worishofen, and the little glasses. That was some tasty stuff.

steveh

01-12-2009, 05:48 PM

I did bring back several bottles of the bierschnapps from Hotel Lowenbrau in Bad Worishofen, and the little glasses. That was some tasty stuff.

Oohh.. yer makin' me homesick for my home away from home! I have a little empty flip-top bottle and the shot-sized Maß from BW too -- we spent a nice evening sampling their beer and Schnapps after dinner on our visit.

Sorry Jay -- back to the subject...

S.

JayShaw91

01-12-2009, 07:40 PM

Hey, it's your site, dude!

steveh

01-13-2009, 08:01 AM

Hey, it's your site, dude!

:confused: Not my site, just an old-timer.

S.

BrewDog

01-13-2009, 09:51 PM

Back to discussing the beer style... and resurrecting this thread :)

Anyone have a guide for the BU:GU ratio for the Amber version? Ray Daniel's book doesn't include ambers... just pale ales.

I have liked the results when my APA's are around .75 BU:GU give or take .10
and when my Ambers are around .50 +- .10.

Just my .02 - other opinions will vary.

JayShaw91

01-14-2009, 07:35 AM

Much appreciated, BDawg.

So for a 1.050 I should be shooting for 25 IBU's? That seems pretty low in my pea brain.

steveh

01-14-2009, 08:27 AM

According to BJCP, American Amber Ales can range between 25 and 40 IBUs and 1.045 to 1.060 OG -- sounds like you have a lot of leeway... as long as you keep the hop aroma down and the flavor up!

Aroma: Low to moderate hop aroma from dry hopping or late kettle additions of American hop varieties. A citrusy hop character is common, but not required. Moderately low to moderately high maltiness balances and sometimes masks the hop presentation, and usually shows a moderate caramel character. Esters vary from moderate to none. No diacetyl.

Flavor: Moderate to high hop flavor from American hop varieties, which often but not always has a citrusy quality...Malt and hop bitterness are usually balanced and mutually supportive.

S.

Mad Scientist

01-14-2009, 09:46 AM

Much appreciated, BDawg.

So for a 1.050 I should be shooting for 25 IBU's? That seems pretty low in my pea brain.

I'd say you could shoot for up to 30 IBU

darylM

01-14-2009, 09:55 AM

My Weeping Willow Ale is an amber and normally shoot for BU:GU of .5. I also like to have malt and hop flavors showing up for the party. That requires lower IBU's and no hop additions pass fifteen minutes. I have also found that some age on the beer is better for it. Weeping Willow gets into its own about 2 months in the bottle following by a week in the fridge. That has been my experience YMMV.

JayShaw91

01-14-2009, 01:15 PM

And once again ya'll are steering me away from my initial ideas :) But that is why I come here is to get guidance.

I'm looking at a 1.052 with 33 IBU's right now, which is like a .63 BU:GU ratio - a bit higher than you're all recommending. My worry is that bumping the malt is going to end up making this thing have a higher terminal gravity than the style calls for.

Interesting you say no hop additions past 15 minutes where the style guidelines to say some versions are dry hopped. I was planning a .5 oz addition of Cascade at flame-out (the 33 IBU cited above does *not* include this flameout addition) just cuzz I never dry hopped before. Yes, I know flameout additions and dry hopping aren't the same, but my readings tell me that you'll get less of a grassy flavor doing the flameout addition, but still get some nice aroma.

The hops plan right now is listed below. As always, give your feedback, boys.

1 oz 7.4% Cascade for 60
.5 oz 9% Cascade at 30
.5 oz 9% Cascade at flameout

steveh

01-14-2009, 01:35 PM

Interesting you say no hop additions past 15 minutes where the style guidelines to say some versions are dry hopped.

No hops in the last part of the boil will keep the hop flavor down. Dry-hopping will add to the aroma. (I think I remember that correctly -- King?)

S.

Mad Scientist

01-14-2009, 01:45 PM

Jay, you're using leaf hops, right? have you accounted for that? Leaf hops usually give slightly less IBU than equivilent weight of pellets....

beerking

01-14-2009, 01:56 PM

No hops in the last part of the boil will keep the hop flavor down. Dry-hopping will add to the aroma. (I think I remember that correctly -- King?)

S.
You are correct, Sir.

BrewDog

01-14-2009, 07:45 PM

Jay,

I wouldn't use a 30 min addition for this beer. move the 30 to 20 or 15 and that'll boost the flavor and lower the bitterness.

Also, for a comparison recipe, take a look at CampAJohn's Mac & Jack's African Amber clone recipe here on page 1 of this thread. It's a really nice malty American Amber (both the real deal as well as John's clone - he's in my brew club and he's made the beer several times for us. It's quite good.).

JayShaw91

01-15-2009, 07:42 AM

Cool, thanks, boys!

Mad, yes, leaf hops, and BeerTools know they're leaf. Good call there!

I like the idea of moving the second addition to 20 minutes. That shaved off 3 IBU.

BD, what about the flameout addition? Dry hop instead? Style guidelines do mention dry hopping. Maybe I'm obsessing on this... :)

BrewDog

01-15-2009, 09:59 PM

I like a flame out addition because the heat draws some level of flavor too.
Your choice, of course. There's room here in this style to play.

JayShaw91

01-16-2009, 07:28 AM

Right on. If it is too hoppy I guess at worst I call it an APA, huh? :) As far as BeerTool is concerned, the recipe sits pretty much right in the middle of all ranges for an Amber, but on the low end of the APA bittering.

That's the only problem with these two styles - they overlap far too much.

darylM

01-16-2009, 12:20 PM

American Ambers came from American Pales, that is why they overlap.

BrewDog

01-16-2009, 10:50 PM

It really is all about the malt, though in an amber. Generous use of Munich/Biscuit/Victory malts help build a nice malty finish.

JayShaw91

01-17-2009, 09:09 AM

Here is my grain bill. It looks like I had the right idea in mind, BD. 1.051 OG, 1.014 FG. Too sweet?

9Lbs Pale ale malt
.5 lb crystal 20
.5lb crystal 40
1lb munich
1lb amber
1lb Victory

Mad Scientist

01-17-2009, 11:25 AM

Not too sweet, but be sure to send me a bottle, I'll let you knkow what I thhink.

JayShaw91

01-17-2009, 12:37 PM

Ha hah... maybe we should think about doing a trade some time.

Thanks as always, boys. I'm going with this and we'll see how she turns out.

BrewDog

01-18-2009, 02:49 PM

I think that looks good, too. Good luck with it and let us know how it turns out.

critch

06-25-2009, 06:30 PM

the native 6-row barley, as opposed to the lower-protein 2-row barley found in Europe.
the only two row you find in the uk is in bread or piss poor macro beer mate;)

the two maltings i use for my brewery only use it for second rate lager malt .......

for the majority of breweries here its 6 row all the way

beerking

06-26-2009, 08:22 AM

the only two row you find in the uk is in bread or piss poor macro beer mate;)

the two maltings i use for my brewery only use it for second rate lager malt .......

for the majority of breweries here its 6 row all the way

Hmmm...that would be true, except for Maris Otter! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maris_Otter
I think Halcyon and Fawcett are also.
Then there is also Golden Promise, which i know is two-row. http://www.brewerssupplygroup.com/malt/simpsons.php

Mad Scientist

06-26-2009, 09:55 AM

Critch, I think you need to review the quality of your 2-row source....I resepctfully disagree with you. Every source I've read on the subject--and my own personal experiece--shows that 2-row is far superior to 6-row, espicially the English varities, and case in point from beerking is Marris Otter.

nelstrodomus

06-26-2009, 07:55 PM

My experience with malts is that english varieties produce more flavorful worts, and eventually beers.

However, I bought 110 lbs of Halcyon malt from north country malt and have been very displeased with the beers I've made from it. They're very sharp/tart/acidic compared to all of my other beers and I don't think my brewing process is to blame.

This may just be a particular batch/supplier issue, but lets say I've stopped using the malt (30 gallons too late!).

Anyone else have an experience like this?

jonlouisville77

12-28-2009, 10:31 AM

Corn meal? Yuck.

S.
I like the idea. Could it be that swigged a few Sterlings or Fall Citys back in the day, my friend? Very corny and alcoholic flavor to those old gems!

Tronathon

09-06-2010, 01:34 PM

corkybstewart

09-06-2010, 01:52 PM

That sounds like a great experiment, and a great way to get used to your setup.
I know nothing about FWHopping so I can't help you there.

JayShaw91

09-06-2010, 02:22 PM

I just used all Citra for my APA recipe. Not a fan. Way too tropical fruity. It didn't give enough hops bitterness for my tastes, and I am far from being a hophead. APA's are "my beer" if you will, along with Sam Adams.

I've used all Cascade in the past and love that, so you'll likely enjoy that beer. If you've had Bud American Ale, you've had an all-Cascade beer, I believe. I'm pretty certain that's a 100% Cascade beer. I know they dry hop with it.

So save yourself from the Citra-only... IMO. It's a much better hop to mix with something than go solo. I'd think it'd be great as a second hop for an IPA.

Tronathon

09-06-2010, 04:28 PM

So save yourself from the Citra-only... IMO. It's a much better hop to mix with something than go solo. I'd think it'd be great as a second hop for an IPA.

Well, I'm still going to try the all Citra APA. It may not turn out to be a favorite brew or anything, but I'm 22 so I got plenty of college age buddies who'd be more than happy to help me get rid of 5gals of it.

That being said, exploring the hop characters is what the whole single hop beers are about for me. I wanna get a grasp on the hops in a beer themselves, not just their profiles as per the internet, books, or others' opinions.

I figured dropping 4 oz of hops into the last 10 minutes of the brew would ensure a strong hop flavor in each brew, thereby accentuating the character of each hop individually. Then I can taste em all side by side and see what's what.

Now I just gotta get 5 more primaries...

BrewDog

09-06-2010, 10:51 PM

What I would suggest is that you use a fixed amount of hop at 15 mins and later, then adjust the amounts you add earlier so that you end up with the same level of IBUs regardless of what beer you end up with.

HTH-

Tronathon

09-07-2010, 05:49 PM

So, I started brewing AG a few months ago and made an ESB, a hefe, a brown ale and a DIPA...but I realized that I don't know very much about the character of the various american hop varieties we have access to. So to explore them more, and to get a better grasp of my brewing set-up's efficiencies and my water's characteristics, I wanna brew a string of APA's using the same grain bill and only changing the hops

Here's my plan for the first one...

10.00 lbs Maris Otter Pale
.33 lbs Caramel 40
.33 lbs Cara Pils

1.5 oz FWH 19.0 IBU
1.0 oz Perle 20 12.7 IBU
1.5 oz Perle 10 11.4 IBU
2.0 oz Perle 1 1.8 IBU

6.0 oz Perle = 45 IBU

I calculated the IBU contribution for the FWH based on the assumption that it's the equivalent to an addition 2/3 into the boil, in my case that's a 20min addition. Is this correct?

If not, my planned additions will be

.500 Perle 60 10.5
.500 Perle 30 8.1
.750 Perle 20 9.5
2.25 Perle 10 15.2
2.50 Perle 1 1.8

6.0 oz Perle = 45 IBU

I'm planning on reproducing the same beer with Cascade, Citra, Amarillo, Ahtanum, Simcoe, maybe Liberty.

What do you guys think?

So, after doing some research on FWH, I discovered that the IBU contribution of FWH is about 10% more than the bitterness of a 60min hop addition. This is due to the higher pH of the wort as it is being run into the boil kettle which increases the isomerization of the AAs. This being said, taste testing has shown FWH to produce a smoother, more even bitterness that is [I]percieved[I] as less bitter. This is where people consider FWH to be similar to a 20min addition in bitterness, I think they are referring to the perceived bitterness.

Some people said to use FWH as a replacement for flavor hop additions (20-5min) while other said to use it in place of bittering additions.

I'm leaning towards the latter, and maybe using a very slight addition at maybe 45min to ensure a thoroughly bittered beer.

10.00 lbs Maris Otter Pale
.33 lbs Caramel 40
.33 lbs Cara Pils

1.50 oz FWH 37 IBU
1.00 oz Perle 20 13.8 IBU
1.50 oz Perle 10 12.4 IBU
2.00 oz Perle 1 1.8 IBU

= 62.3 IBU

but 37 of that is FWH which is perceived as less bitter. hoping that equates to about 45 IBU...

If the FWH tastes like a 20min hop addition that'd be 20.5 IBU's which, would be 13.8+12.4+1.8+20.5 = 48.5 IBU's.

whatcha guys think?

Anyone able to maybe throw the above numbers into Beersmith if they got a spare second and see if my numbers are reasonable correct?

Tronald T Dumps

Baacktoberfest

11-28-2010, 10:05 PM

So I'm going to be brewing like a mad man over the holidays and I want to make one brew that will really blow my wife away. I want her to:

A. Think it's delicious and bless my hobby.
B. Think it's delicious and bless my hobby.
C. Think it's delicious and bless my hobby.

So here's what I came up with.

6 lb Northern Brewer Pilsen LME
1 lb Orange Blossom Honey
1 lb Muntons Wheat DME
1 lb Milk Sugar (Lactose)
.75 lb Honey Malt
.25 Biscuit Malt

.75-1 oz Citra 60 min
Zest of 2 oranges and 1/2 lime - 15 min

18-20 IBU
6.9% ABV

What do ya think fellas?

corkybstewart

11-29-2010, 08:49 AM

First of all what are you trying to brew here, does she have a particular beer she likes?
The honey will ferment out completely leaving little if any sweetness or honey flavor so I'd drop it. It will also thin your beer out, if that's what you want you can do that with much cheaper table sugar. Cut the lactose in half if not gone completely because the wheat DME will have some residual sweetness.
If you want something Blue Moonish I would cut the Pilsen DME to 4 pounds and increase the wheat DME to 3 pounds.
Add the zest at flameout to preserve more aromatics, if you boil them I think they'll drive off the flavor and just leave orange peel bitterness.

Baacktoberfest

11-29-2010, 09:23 AM

Her favorite beer is Buffalo Bill's Orange Blossom Cream Ale. I'm trying to do something similar. I'm not trying to duplicate it-it's just a starting point.

Mad Scientist

11-29-2010, 10:33 AM

I agree with Corky, ditch the milk sugar. I'll stick with the honey, but why the wheat extract?

I've never had the beer you refrenced, btw, not available to me.

corkybstewart

11-29-2010, 10:54 AM

If you add the honey to your fermenter after fermentation starts it may retain some of the honey flavors, but in the boil all you'll get are the 100% fermentable sugars.
I have never brewed a cream ale but I think part of their characteristic flavor comes from a corn addition, maybe a pound of flaked maize instead of the wheat extract in your original recipe.

Baacktoberfest

11-29-2010, 11:01 AM

Would I have to do a mini mash with that maize or would I just steep it with the gambrinus and biscuit?

BrewDog

11-29-2010, 07:49 PM

Take a look at the recipe I posted in the wheat beers thread here called "Orange Blossom Special". It uses 3lbs of Orange Blossom honey and is a true "Woman pleaser", if you know what I mean ;)
(Seriously, it's a 6.9% beer that drinks like its 4.5%. One of my buddies nicknamed it the "Panty Melter".)

http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=3581

Mad Scientist

11-29-2010, 08:25 PM

I like panty solvent beeter

davisjon

02-27-2011, 07:27 PM

The first batch I ever brewed was an APA, and I loved it. The flavor was great, bitterness nice, but I think I can do it better the 2nd time around. Here was the recipe I brewed the first time:

6.6#golden light LME
1# Crystal 40L
1oz centenial 60min
1oz cascades 15min
1oz cascade 5 min
1oz cascade dry hop
US-05 ale yeast

OG: 1.042
FG: 1.010

The beer was a little on the thin side, so I think I will up the amount of extract to 7 pounds or so to try to bring both the OG and FG up a bit. But my biggest problem was that the beer was very "one-note" tasting, probably due to the fact that I used exclusively cascades for the flavor. To me, it seemed a bit heavy on the grapefruit and lacked any other complexity. To add this complex flavor profile I am looking for, should I use combinations of different hops? What times, maybe more mid boil? Does anyone have any suggestions for what hops would compliment this and add more than just the citrus/bitter flavors I got the first time?

Thanks in advance!

MootsLnbKing

02-27-2011, 08:19 PM

Simco, Amirillo,and some Columbus.;)

BrewDog

02-27-2011, 09:14 PM

+1 on Amarillo & Columbus. I find Simcoe "catty".
Try a bit of Chinook for a flavor addition for some piney notes to add complexity.
Also, i'd consider throwing in about 3/4 cup of maltodextrin powder in addtion to moving up to 7 lbs of extract.

HTH-

davisjon

02-27-2011, 10:01 PM

maltodextrin just makes it thicker, right? I am a little unsure of what it is/does exactly. Also, along with changing the hop types, would you change the time schedule of additions at all?

vance71975

02-27-2011, 10:53 PM

maltodextrin just makes it thicker, right? I am a little unsure of what it is/does exactly. Also, along with changing the hop types, would you change the time schedule of additions at all?

It increases body.

JayShaw91

02-28-2011, 09:23 AM

I think the time schedule is fine. Also, I personally like Simcoe. It's another citrusy hop, but not like Cascade. It's got more of a tropical flavor. You could try that mid-boil and some Chinook to break up all the citrus.

davisjon

03-02-2011, 04:37 PM

With all your suggestions, I have come up with a new recipe that I think I will try out, although it has turned into more of an American IPA than APA.

Palindromic IPA
8 # LME
1 # Caramel 40L
.5 oz Columbus 60 min
.5 oz Simcoe 20 min
.5 oz Chinook 10 min
.5 oz Cascade 10 min
.5 oz Cascade 5 min
.5 oz Chinook 5 min
.5 oz Simcoe dry hop
.5 oz Columbus dry hop
1 pk. nottingham yeast

OG: 1.058
FG: 1.012
Color 13 SRM
Alcohol: 6.1%
Bitterness: 60IBU

I entertained my humor by dry hopping with the bittering hops to make the hop schedule palindromic. Would there be any problem with this, or what flavors could I expect. I really don't want to overdo the grapefruit of cascades like I did last time, so I was thinking of dry hopping with something different, but still citrusy.

vance71975

03-02-2011, 04:47 PM