Chocolate Stout that is no more

[irishmac13]

I am drinking one of the few Chocolate Stouts from HC Berger. HC Berger is now out of biz. We showed up one day to do some tasting with an out of town guest and saw the notice on the door. Very sad day. I have grown to appreciate HC Berger's Ch Stout and their Snowman Ale. Bought a few cases of each after we found out they closed. Down to the last few.

[Beer Nazi]

That's a shame.

Hopefully you can find solace in another chocolate stout....I like Young's Double Chocolate Stout myself. The cans have a pressure cartridge that gives it a draught head.

[cgarri]

Second the Young's. That and Samuel Smith's Taddy Porter are the two beers I always have in my frig.

Craig

[mymaestro]

My fave is Stone Brewing Russian Imperial Stout - but you have to go to California to get it :-(

[BeerSponge]

Yea real bummer, I attended a tasting in Fort Worth, TX. a few years ago hosted by the great one himself, Michael Jackson. HC's Chocolate Stout was on his list that night. I was able to acquire a case of it during a recent trip to Fort Collins, Colo. I didn't believe that the Brewery was actually closed so I drove to the brewery itself and found locked doors. Turns out the owner was over due on tax payments. I sacrificed my last bottle to make a nice winter beef stew, exceptional.

HC Berger will be missed.

[BeerCheese]

I hate when that happens! There are some very good chocolate porters in my neck of the woods (Ultra-Northern California). Mocha Porter from Rogue Brewing in Newport, Oregon and Muddy Mocha Porter from Humboldt Brewing in Arcata, California.
Regarding Imperial Stouts, Old Rasputin from North Coast Brewing in Fort Bragg, California is a personal favorite.

[tjthresh]

Rouge also has a Chocolate Stout out right now. Its not bad.

[Sorny]

Youngs has to be one of the best i have tasted but i'm sure there are more chocolate stouts out there just waiting to be sampled by all.

[Richard English]

I was surprised to learn that Young's Chocolate Stout is supplied in cans in the USA. Over here it is sold in bottles (and is, of course, bottle conditioned)

One of the very best stouts I have even drunk is Lion Stout, from the Lion Brewery in SRI LANKA. (No relation to any other Lion Brewery). At about 8.5%abv it is a beer for the serious drinker.

And yes, it is available in the UK but as for the USA...

[mkIIjunkie]

i was lucky enough to come across a six of lion stout when i was stationed at macdill, afb, tampa. their class six holds a variety of unconventional brews. i haven't seen it on the shelves since then, nor can i request an shipment of it. from my research, it's not readily available in the us. makes me wish that i rationed what i purchased at the time. i can't disagree with jackson.

[Glarus]

Lion Stout (from Sri Lanka) is indeed a very good stout when fresh. I was amazed, about a year or so ago, to see it at one of my favorite liquor stores in Milwaukee, WI. I had seen it offered as part of the Jackson World Beer Tour, but thought that it was otherwise unavailable in the US. Who knows?

[skar]

Originally posted by Richard English
I was surprised to learn that Young's Chocolate Stout is supplied in cans in the USA. Over here it is sold in bottles (and is, of course, bottle conditioned)


I've purchased Young's Chocolate Stout in a bottle, in the US. I think the cans are a recent addition.

[alcfron]

Young's Chocolate Stout is packaged both in bottles and the widget can. The differences are striking - the bottle is (not surprisingly) considerably thicker and more complex.

[Richard English]

I see no reason to stray from my previous stance here. I don't believe you can get top-quality beer in cans, any more than you can get top-quality wine in cans. The bottle is the traditional home for quality drinks and long may it so remain!

[Boto]

I have seen the North Coast Old Rasputin in MA. Another fav is the Brooklyn Stout. Both are highly rated by me (& others) if you can find them.

[alcfron]

this year's Brooklyn choc. stout was exceptional. Also, Avery's the Czar was full of sweet goodness, but more toffee flavor than chocolate.

[Boto]

Drew:

I hope ratebeer is back up soon with the problems fixed. I'm going into withdrawl!!!

[alcfron]

yeah, no kidding. i've got a number of ratings to write up, and I"m really missing the site.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by Richard English
I see no reason to stray from my previous stance here. I don't believe you can get top-quality beer in cans, any more than you can get top-quality wine in cans. The bottle is the traditional home for quality drinks and long may it so remain!

A possible exception that proves the rule is Guinness, if you ask me. The Extra Stout doesn't do much for me, and the new "bottle with widget" thing that they have going where they insist that you can just DRINK IT RIGHT OUT OF THE BOTTLE (blasphemy!) just tastes awful. The can is the best that Guinness is going to get on this side of the pond, nitro-purged cask conditioned draughts notwithstanding.

When forced to do so, I actually prefer to drink beers (?) like Corona right from the bottle... it keeps me from tasting too much of it. ;)

[Richard English]

Guinness is not, of course, Real Ale by CAMRA's definition. Keg Guinness has been pressurised by nitrogen for many years (which is why it's not as fizzy as most other keg beers which are pressurised with carbon dioxide.).

In some ways Guinness must always be an exception. If all brewers made as good a job with their Keg Beers as Guinness did, then there's a fair chance that the consumer revolution against chemical fizz would never have happened!

Until a few years ago Guinness was bottle-conditioned; now it's brewery conditioned with artificially-added carbon dioxide and I personally believe it's not so good as it used to be. Unfortunately there is now no way in which one can make a comparitive tasting but I do note that bottle-conditioned stouts seem to received much approbation on this board (as they do on the OBBD site).

Canned Guinness is very much the same product as keg Guinness, so if you like keg Guinness you'll like canned Guinness.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by Richard English
Guinness is not, of course, Real Ale by CAMRA's definition...

Please forgive my newbieness (yet again), but why would Guinness not be considered a "real ale"? Do they use something in their ingredients that they're not supposed to?

And another thing... can you taste the can when you drink a "widget" Guinness? I swear I still can, but it may be my brain playing games with me....

[Richard English]

Real Ale is beer that is made only from water, malt, hops and yeast. It is not artificially carbonated, neither is is pasteurised or filtered.

Most mass-produced beers fail on several counts - Guinness because it is artificially carbonated.

For a full explanation, let Ninkasi tell you all - go to http://www.camra.org.uk/SHWebClass.asp?WCI=ShowCat&CatId=244

And yes, I do believe you can taste the aluminium in the can which is why I only drink bottled or cask beers!

[Theakston]

There are a lot of excellent ales that I would consider "Real" that do not conform to that extremely strict definition. You are combining the German Purity Law - only Malt, Hops, Water and Yeast - which is OK for most German style beer (mostly lagers) with the CAMRA definition - only cask or bottle conditioned - that is certainly the best way to enjoy english draught ales (cask) and many belgian or other strong ales (bottle).

Most Belgian beers, and many English classics, do contain items that are outside of the German Purity Law. While the basis is usually Malt Hops Water and Yeast, many contain unmalted barley or wheat (a true Lambic for example must contain a high percentage of wheat) or other adjuncts such as Oatmeal or even Rye. Many beers also contain various types of sugar - and this includes many classic English beers.

Many belgian beers contain candy sugar and other spices such as coriander, cardamon and orange peel. Others contain fruit.

As far as bottle conditioning is concerned. Yes I would prefer it but I do not consider it to be essential to the enjoyment of all styles of beer and I would consider it an unnecessary restriction.

By your definition Theakstons Old Peculier is not a real ale. It fails on all counts as it contains sugars and is not bottle conditioned. Of course it is at it's best on draft in front of a fire in an old stone pub in the Yorkshire Dales, but it's still damn good in the bottle for us that don't live there (anymore).

[Richard English]

You're right, of course! I was trying to condense the definition too much. The additives bit was really about the kinds of "rubbish" additives that I have so frequently condemned.

Theakstons OP is still a fair beer but is nothing like it used to be. Once the family sold out I believe it went downhill. As you probably know, the Theakston family are still brewing under the Black Sheep label.