how does this kit look?

[boostn]

Tell me what you think. I have not been please with the kits that I have been buying so I am trying a different supplier. Here is the list.
English Brown Ale
3 lbs. light dried malt extract
2 lbs. dark dried malt extract
2 cups carapils, 1 cup chocolate, 2 cups crystal 120L
1.25 oz guggle (bittering)
1 oz fuggle (aromatic whole hops)
2tsp gypsum
1 tsp irish moss
The yeast is the white labs british ale yeast

The problem is the flavor. I have not been pleased with the results. Does this kit look like it is put together for a good tasting beer. I plan on doing the whole grain tech. soon to see the difference. Thanks for any help that is given. :)

Also, when do the aromatic hops go in? The bittering hops go in at the start of the boil, correct?


Michael

[Trogger]

Aroma hops go in at the end of the boil--either the last couple minutes or throw them in and turn the flame off right away. I do the latter, then put the lid on to keep the flavor/aroma in the kettle. Don't cool for 10-15 minutes...

From my own limited experience, the kit looks OK. I’m not sure why they are measuring the grain in cups, as it is typically done in pounds and ounces..a more accurate measure. Depending on how hard your local water is, the gypsum may not be needed.
Chocolate and crystal 120L malts are good stuff. They add good flavor and color…
Taste satisfaction problem could be anything from ingredients, to water quality/make up, to brew techniques… etc.. I guess you’ll have to see.
Example: I love brown ales. I made one and it’s my least favorite of the 5 batches I’ve completed so far. I think it may partly be my own inexperienced brewing techniques, as opposed to the actual kit itself…

[YamahaXS]

i also wonder what a cup of grain weighs on average....

I would guess about .5 pounds.

I think the recipe will turn out fine, but perhaps a bit dark for a traditional brown though. It depends on how much a cup of chocolate malt weighs. I wouldn't suggest more than .25 pound.

[Trogger]

I used only a quarter pound of Chocolate malt in a stout, so more than that could be a large amount for color/flavor in a brown ale...nothing wrong with darker color, and richer flavor. Just depends on what you are looking for. Come to think of it, 2 cups of Carapils is a lot too...(I use .5 pounds when I use it.)

[Grog]

What component of the flavor do you find objectionable? (i.e. too bitter, too sweet, extract twang...) I think if you could narrow down what it is you don't like about the flavor, we could be more helpful.

-G-

[boostn]

Well, I would have to say that it taste watered down. That's the best i can come up with. There are some things i am going to do different this time. I usually would put the grain bag in and bring the temp up to a boil. Right before the boil I would pull the grain bag out. I was told not to take the temp. over 180 so that is what I will do this time. I hope it helps.

Michael

[YamahaXS]

is there a commercial beer that you can identify as your 'target'?

[boostn]

Yes, the kit is supposed to taste like "newcastle". Thanks for your help.

Michael

[Grog]

My chocolate malt weighs 5oz per cup (I just had to find know!!!)

This means if yours is similar, then you have approximately 10oz of CaraPils & 120°L Crystal & 5oz of chocolate. With you're DME you hit about 1.042 which is at the low end for the style.

You might try adding 1lb of Cara pils instead of 10oz and maybe a bit more crystal (not as dark though) which should add some heft to the finished product. You might also consider adding 1lb more of the DME. If you did all of these things you should have a beer that is 1.050-ish with more body and mouthfeel.

Just a suggestion.

-G-

[danno]

skip the gypsum altogether, not even sure why it's added for an extract recipe... (the rule of thumb is: if you don't understand water modifications, don't do them. 90% of water doesn't need adjusting...)

two weeks ago I judged a flight of APA's and American Brown ales, and for the most part they all seemed to lack enough of the desired caramel character (this would also help combat the "watered down" character you're getting). I'd consider skipping the chocolate altogether, and upping the caramel to 1.25 lbs. ProMash doesn't have a 120L, but 105L Crystal @ 1.25 lbs (18% of your malt bill) gives a 18 SRM, which fits in the "Northern English brown ale" guidelines (12-22 SRM)...

edit: whatever you do, don't boil your grains. if you take them over 170ºF you will start extracting tannins which will give you a harsh, astringent taste. just don't do it. please...

2nd edit: I didn't mention Carapils up above, but when I plugged your recipe into promash, I used 1/2 lb, and kept your extract amounts the same...

[noby]

Just as a by the way, a cup is 8 fl.oz. So, I usually take that as a cup of grain being 8oz

[Trogger]

Originally posted by noby
Just as a by the way, a cup is 8 fl.oz. So, I usually take that as a cup of grain being 8oz

Keep in mind that fl (fluid) ounces are different from weight ounces and shouldn't be interchanged. Fluid ounces are actually a measure of volume, so 8 fluid ounces of cotton would weigh maybe less than 1 ounce in weight measure. Always use a scale for grains.

[BrewDog]

I'd have to guess the gypsum is there to approximate the Burton high calcium & sulfate levels. I'm a little bit surprised the kit didn't contain Burton salts explicitly for this reason. Then again, gypsum powder is cheaper. What Danno says is right, though. If you aren't sure why you are using a water mod, you probably shouldn't be using it.

I also agree with Grog - Add another lb of light DME and increase the crystal and carapils.

I don't have ProMash handy. Did anybody figure out how many IBU's it comes out to? What AAU% are the fuggles? I'd guess you'll probably need to increase to somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.5 oz to account for the extra gravity. Aroma hop levels won't need to change, though.

[edit to fix fat finger typos]