Black and Tan

[Spicoli]

Forgive me for being naive. Was the original Black and Tan Guiness and Bass together??????
I know they have black and tans in single bottles like Mississippi Mud. Is it even correct to call it a black and tan if it is brewed all together????????

I used to get a black and tan at this pub in Sonoma county called "The Old Vic." I just can't remember the actual combination.

[danno]

Originally posted by Spicoli
Is it even correct to call it a black and tan if it is brewed all together???????? I think they are called "brown"... :D

but yes, a "traditional" black and tan is Guinness and Bass...

[BluesHarp]

...is that the same as a half and half , or an " 'alf n 'alf"...;)

[fuji6100]

half n half is guiness over harp

At least, that's what it is state-side

[steveh]

Not sure about the origins of the "mixed" black and tans such as Spicoli (was that your skull?) is asking about, but Fuji's correct about a half and half being Guinness on Harp.

Used to be that if you ordered a "Black and Tan" in Ireland, especially Dublin, you'd get a terse history lesson. The B&T borrowed its name from the volunteer English regiment that ran rampant over Ireland during the troubles in the early 20th century (English beer being in the mix).

Funny thing is, Americans have tended toward using B&T and H&H synonymously. When last in Dublin, I was waiting for my departure flight at the airport bar when a young American couple ordered H&Hs. To their chagrin, that's exactly what they got - though not what they'd been expecting. They explained to the bar tender that H&Hs are made with Bass in America (big sigh). The polite 'tender poured them new drinks using Guinness and the English ale on tap.

The somewhat less than polite beer geek to their right at the bar explained the difference between B&Ts and H&Hs to them (fighting the urge to use his wonderfully authentic brogue ;)), they were amazed and astounded. Hey, at least they didn't order Spudweiser, right?

S.

Oh yeah, Blues - that'd be 'arf and 'arf! ;-)

[noby]

Originally posted by steveh
The B&T borrowed its name from the volunteer English regiment that ran rampant over Ireland during the troubles in the early 20th century (English beer being in the mix).


Is this true? I often wondered was there a connection or was the name a coincidence.
I guess the name hasn't helped its popularity here. The only people I've seen order it are Americans.

[BluesHarp]

Thanks Steveh, I didn't know the whole history but I was quite sure they were two different drinks- - one with Harp, one with Bass...

[steveh]

Originally posted by noby Is this true? I often wondered was there a connection or was the name a coincidence.

'Tis - of course it begs the question, which really came first?

I guess the name hasn't helped its popularity here. The only people I've seen order it are Americans.

I've heard the same thing, but I imagine there was some popularity there at some time, maybe more so in England? How about the half and half's popularity in Ireland, has it also waned?

S.

[noby]

Originally posted by steveh
'Tis - of course it begs the question, which really came first?


From my understanding, the Black and Tans (the soldiers) were so called from their mis-match army-surplus uniforms, from a shortage of uniforms post-WW1

Originally posted by steveh
How about the half and half's popularity in Ireland, has it also waned?


Very much so. On the same lines as B&T, seldom ordered, usually by tourists.
The most common 'mix' with a Guinness is a dash of blackcurrant


Cormac.

[steveh]

Originally posted by noby From my understanding, the Black and Tans (the soldiers) were so called from their mis-match army-surplus uniforms, from a shortage of uniforms post-WW1

I've read that origin too, but I wonder if the uniform so resembled the drink that the nickname became an obvious choice - or vice-versa? I had always heard the soldiers' name begat the drink's nickname, but perhaps it was the soldiers who cast such a bad shadow over the drink that its popularity so diminished?

The most common 'mix' with a Guinness is a dash of blackcurrant

Is that to the Extra Stout, or the draught? I can see it being a good mix with the Extra. What about a mix of Guinness draught and Champagne? I've seen that offered at a pub or two in Dublin, even Guinness draught and cider.

S.

[toneyc]

The Guinness and Champagne mix is called a Black Velvet.

:)
Toney.

[noby]

Originally posted by steveh

Is that to the Extra Stout, or the draught?

The draught. I guess it sweetens it a bit. Never tried it myself.

Guinness & champagne (black velvet) is not the sort of thing you'd normally order down the local.
Guinness & cider is the 'poor man's black velvet', although I've yet to see anyone drink it.

There was a fad of having a shot of Guinness in your Smithwicks some years back (or so I've been told)


As for the B&T, whatever the origin, it probably wasn't a popular drink to order 80 years ago here. Maybe it was just ordered as a half'n'half.

[guildofevil]

Originally posted by noby

There was a fad of having a shot of Guinness in your Smithwicks some years back (or so I've been told)


I used to drink that about 15 years ago. It's known as Smithwicks with a Guinness head.

Séan