Oct. 9th: Parallel tasting

[fretlessman71]

Wow! These are getting really fun! We didn't have as many people as last time, but it's still very interesting to taste beer with an educated palate (or, at the very least, a palate that's being educated in realtime). Anyone who wants to join is welcome - just download AIM at www.aol.com (it's also known as AOL Instant Messenger), and the day of the tasting post your AIM username into the next thread on this subject (I'll explain in a minute) and indicate your desire to join us. We'll get you into the fold!

Now, instead of beginning with a poll, I want a few nominations. We've talked about a brown ale, a pumpkin ale (probably not a good idea - people either love them or hate them), or possibly one of the DogFish Head offerings, such as the 60 min. IPA or Shelter Pale Ale. My thoughts are to have something seasonally appropriate, as by then I'm sure we'll all have begun to notice the chill in the autumn air. So go ahead and post your thoughts, and over the next three days or so I'll compile the results and narrow it down to the most popular two or three for a poll. PLEASE, though... if you're not planning on attending, don't innundate us with ideas, on the other hand, if you have a really nice suggestion and just can't make it that day, then fire away!

So I'll begin: I'd like to try a decent, readily available Brown Ale... though I'm a little hard pressed to come up with a nationally available variety. Maybe DFH Indian Brown?

[Bruno_78]

I know that it has also been suggested that we delay a little longer in the day. Even if we could hold off fifteen or thirty minutes, that would help me out a bunch.

[fretlessman71]

The possibility of doing this at the 30 could work.... whatch'all think?

Much later than that, and I'm usually off to a gig...

[newportstorm]

I never seem to be around for these so take it for what it's worth, but finding a good national brown ale might be more difficult than it sounds. DFH is available in less than half the states. Brooklyn (solid Brown) is an east coast brand. And I am unsure about Harpoon's distribution (Munich Dark is solid). You could always go with a <shudder> Newcastle :eek:

Cheers!

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by newportstorm
You could always go with a <shudder> Newcastle. No we couldn't... ;)

[b3s]

hey, how about keystone light? (ok, that WAS a joke :p)

i wouldn't mind doing another okto or mrzen...that, or maybe a belgian dubbel. dfh 90 minute would be good, too.

but good god, not newcastle!

[threecb]

Rats! I'll miss this one, too!

Goin' down ta Tennessee for my new niece's christening, so I'll be in the car while ya'll are samplin'...:(

[fretlessman71]

Refreshing this thread because there haven't been a whole lot of ideas for this one... did you miss this one before?

Can everyone/anyone get DFH Indian Brown? Just a thought...

[steveh]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Can everyone/anyone get DFH Indian Brown? Just a thought...

I'll have to look.

There's been a Belgian beer contingent rattling sabres, and don't forget all of our bottle-conditioned friends - Young's SLA?

S.

[chazwicke]

I was away so I did not see this until today. I'll go along with whatever is decided on. Only thing to remember is it has to be something we can get nationally. Can everyone get Youngs or Fullers? We get a lot of the Rogue beers on the Right coast. I'd imagine they have a wide distribution. Anchor does too.

[fretlessman71]

I can get Fuller's, Young's, Rogue AND Anchor here in CO. All are great suggestions!

steveh, what sort of belgian would be nationally available?

[chazwicke]

there are many but Chimay would probably be the easiest to find. I would recommend saving the dubbles and triples until the cold months. Now a nice gueuze or tart kriek.......

[b3s]

bah, a good tripel this time of year is music to my taste buds ;)

[Jeff]

Fullers is no longer available in my area, I just drank my last bottle of the porter a couple weeks ago.:(

I might not be able to make it many more tastings though because I now have a part time job that could take up significant time on my weekends.

[newportstorm]

I'm pretty sure Rogue distributes in at least 49 states (possibly all 50). Even is places that don't see the more obscure Rogue offerings, the Dead Guy & American Amber seem to be standards. Anchor is shipped to all 50 and their Porter is a tasty beer.

Cheers!

[chazwicke]

Maybe we should vote amoungst the actual participants this Saturday and include the members who won't be there this time but usually are, like Threecb.

[fretlessman71]

Not sure I understand... but I'm all for including anyone's opinion who's been there in the past, and those who can't be there this time around

Drinking my first non-skunked PU - it's DEFINITELY not P-U! I can even taste that melanoidin quality... very good stuff! Someone get steveh on the boards quick! :)

[threecb]

Originally posted by chazwicke
Maybe we should vote amoungst the actual participants this Saturday and include the members who won't be there this time but usually are, like Threecb.

I'd speak up, but I'm missing this one too -- as i mentioned earlier in this thread. :( Thanks for thinking of me, though, chaz!

As for the ones mentioned, I can get them all in this area. I like the Rogue idea to get another domestic we can all get. Or Anchor.

Fullers or Youngs seems like a good Idea, too, since we haven't had an English ale yet.

[Bruno_78]

Fret, I got to try the PU on tap with steveh this weekend. It was very good, and no off flavors. Glad you enjoyed it too.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Bruno_78
It was very good, and no off flavors.

If there can be "Real Ale," why can't we coin a new category as "Real Lager?" Differentiating the good stuff from the flavorless, thin swill that's out there pretending.

I was hangin' with another buddy yesterday who was drinking some Urquell from a 12 pack and praising its merits.

S.

[fretlessman71]

I see no reason not to do just that. Steveh, you going to start up CAMRL? :D

[chazwicke]

Steveh, What would you say your consumption percentages are?

?? % Lager

?? % Ale


I'm really not sure what mine would shake out at but it is probably something like 65% Ale and 35% Lager.

Now if I lived in the UK, it would be more like 95% - 5% in favor of ale

[steveh]

Originally posted by chazwicke
Steveh, What would you say your consumption percentages are?

Not sure, since I've been doing the tastings for RealBeer and also getting trades, I'd guess it would be close to 50 - 50% though.

It definitely was at the beer fest this weekend - an old home-brew friend had an outstanding Robust Porter - on his own beer engine, no less. I'm not an Ale-Basher by any means at all, just don't like to see good lager take the brunt of the swill passing itself off as beer. Doesn't anyone remember Balantine Pale Ale? Brewed in Indiana? Blech.

S.

[chazwicke]

I know I tease about being a lager boy and it's all in fun. I think when most people bash lagers they are really intending it to be the BMC beers.

Ballantine made an ale that actually was a decent beer as was Genny 12 horse. The Ballantine was pre - Indiana / Falstaff, Lucky, Narragansett, merger.

Genessee probably makes some watered down version of the 12 horse still. I'm not sure.

There is no shame in drinking a noble lager. It does deserve respect. I thank you for educating several of the posters on this board to that fact. I've even had more lager this summer because of the discussions on this board and because some of those lagers just go soooo well on a hot summer day.

[Beaver]

Originally posted by chazwicke
I know I tease about being a lager boy and it's all in fun. I think when most people bash lagers they are really intending it to be the BMC beers.


I think you are correct Chaz. It's kind of like the whole BMC and macro discussion. lager != macro != BMC but some people use the terms interchangeably.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Beaver
lager != macro != BMC but some people use the terms interchangeably.

Right, and that's the stigma I'm trying to alter... trying.

Chaz, I'm pretty sure I tasted the Ballantine before the merger with Falstaff, et al. It was pretty unremarkable, even for those days. A buddy and I had to find it back in the late 70s because it was so "different" and "rare" for our area. I sort of remember thinking it reminded me of Ginger Ale - pretty gassy, thin, sort of tinny/sharp tasting. But that was 25 years ago...

About mid-80s, I remember drinking it on Euchre night with my ex-father-in-law and figuring out the little pictograms under the bottle caps. That was definitely after Falstaff was brewing it - remember joking that it was an "Indiana" Pale Ale. ;)

S.

[chazwicke]

I remembered the pictographs as I was writing the post. They were fun. I have a few (4) of the bottles that were brewed in the 30s and aged in wood until the 1950s and were personalized and given out to brewery friends. All four of mine went to the same person. These are quite rare and I have read about tastings of these when they occasionally pop up. They supposedly have held up well. I think Lew Bryson may have written about one tasting of antique beers that he was in on.

The Ballantine of the 70s at least had some flavor and I stand by my feeling that it was probably better than most of the other mass produced American beers at the time. I'm sure it would not compare with todays offerings. Another beer that i drank my fair sahre of was Straub. A regional in Northwestern PA. It was slightly higher in alcohol and had a dryer flavor. They do use flaked maize in the brewing process though. It had a different, distinct flavor from the other crap out there. The Genny 12 horse was re-introduced in the late 70s and it too impressed me at the time because it had flavor too. And lastly, I drank many a steinie bottle of Yuengling Porter another beer with flavor in a sea of flavorless brands available at the time. None of these would probably be considered very good compared to what we now have available.

I was fortunate to live near the Brickskeller and always had a huge selection of imports and obscure beers available. I was even fortunate to have a bottle of New Albion Stout from the real first micro.

[b3s]

Originally posted by Bruno_78
Fret, I got to try the PU on tap with steveh this weekend. It was very good, and no off flavors. Glad you enjoyed it too.

PU on tap is one of my favorite draws...as long as the place doesn't pull the glass out of cryogenic storage and have liquid nitrogen cooled beer lines!

i got the strangest look last weekend when i ordered an odell's 90 schilling and the lady put on the lab gloves and pulled out a pint glass from their 0 degrees kelvin scale cooler and i said "um, could i have a room temperature glass please?"

anyway, back to the poll...have we even settled on a style of beer yet?

[b3s]

Originally posted by Beaver
I think you are correct Chaz. It's kind of like the whole BMC and macro discussion. lager != macro != BMC but some people use the terms interchangeably.

oh, the irony...at least budweiser (not sure about the others) considers itself not just a lager, but a pilsner (using bland malts, rice, and only 10 IBUs)...and then somehow (e.g. tossed a #@#* load of cash around) made budvar, one of the original pilsners that has been around since methusela was a boy (ok, slight exageration), change its name in the US.

ok, i kind of feel better now ;)

[b3s]

Originally posted by steveh
Right, and that's the stigma I'm trying to alter... trying.


heh! speaking for myself, it's not that i think lagers == BMC, it's that i prefer ales ;)

prefer in this case means, given a choice between two decent beers, i will tend to go with the ale.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by b3s


anyway, back to the poll...have we even settled on a style of beer yet? Excellent point, b3s... and one I was just about to make a post on! We really need to settle this. I vote that we limit our postings for the next few days to suggestions ONLY. If you concur, make a post on that as well. Something belgian? Rogue is another thought, and seems to be readily available. What's the most commonly available Rogue brew? They're ALL good.... :)

[b3s]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Excellent point, b3s... and one I was just about to make a post on! We really need to settle this. I vote that we limit our postings for the next few days to suggestions ONLY. If you concur, make a post on that as well. Something belgian? Rogue is another thought, and seems to be readily available. What's the most commonly available Rogue brew? They're ALL good.

given that the last and the upcoming tastings are/were/will/could be lager styles, i'd like to see some kind of ale next.

i can always go with something belgian as long as it's not from new belgium brewery (ok, unfair, the 1554 is pretty good). i've been in the mood for a good dubbel or trippel of late. as an aside, i've been leery of trying lambics...maybe that's an idea, too.

perhaps fullers 1845. dead guy (rogue) is pretty available from my understanding, as is DFH shelter pale.

btw, quick note about beers not necessarily available in certain areas...we could always make sure that whatever beer we choose for the poll is available from liquid solutions for the tastings. considering the fact that we choose 2-4 weeks in advance, that could be a solution to the regional or rare beer issue.

with belgians, well, there's always belgianshop.com (professional note: worst web site design ever...but at least the navigation sucks, too).

note to fret: since we're both having issues with getting westy 12, wanna go in together for the westy super pack (http://www.belgianshop.com/shop/en-us/dept_22.html)? if we do, i can place the order as i was thinking of getting some cheese, too.

[fretlessman71]

Maybe someday... that's more money than I can spend on beer right now. But it's a good idea for sometime in the future! (Besides, what do we do - split the crate in half, too? ;) )

I would think that Fullers 1845 might be the best choice... and we'd have to badger Richard to join us and either play moderator or tasting expert. His dry sense of humor would be an excellent compliment to the rich flavors and textures of the 1845!

[steveh]

Originally posted by b3s
i got the strangest look last weekend when i ordered an odell's 90 schilling and the lady put on the lab gloves and pulled out a pint glass from their 0 degrees kelvin scale cooler and i said "um, could i have a room temperature glass please?"

GAWD! I hate that! They look at you like you're nuts, and I give 'em the same look back! The Asst. Manager of my local asked me how I was enjoying the Sam Adams Okto just added to the tap line. I told him it was good, but waaay too cold. He laughed and said the Miller Lite drinkers were just telling him their swill was too warm (kegs in the same dispensing cooler). I asked if they were complaining because they could finally taste their dreg and realized how bad it really was? Shee.

And doesn't the micro have any sort of education program when a tavern takes on their beers? Um, please don't serve our beer in a frozen glass.

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by b3s
prefer in this case means, given a choice between two decent beers, i will tend to go with the ale.

You need to expound - tell us why you'd immediately choose the ale. Just a reflex reaction? What if it were a choice between Paulaner Salvator and Youngs Old Nick (steering in the opposite direction of my usual comparison in lieu of the seasons)? Both are very similar in character, body, and complexity? Would you immediately grab the Youngs just because? And why?

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
I would think that Fullers 1845 might be the best choice...

An easy one for me to land. My local also has Chimay Blue and Red label, as well as most of the Youngs offerings.

And while I'm needling b3s about choice, I do agree with him about spreading wealth...even though the 2 lagers we tried are completely different styles - and we did start with an ale. ;)

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by b3s
...we could always make sure that whatever beer we choose for the poll is available from liquid solutions for the tastings. considering the fact that we choose 2-4 weeks in advance, that could be a solution to the regional or rare beer issue.

An interesting idea. Is LS pretty good with prices and shipping?

S.

[b3s]

Originally posted by steveh
You need to expound - tell us why you'd immediately choose the ale. Just a reflex reaction? What if it were a choice between Paulaner Salvator and Youngs Old Nick (steering in the opposite direction of my usual comparison in lieu of the seasons)? Both are very similar in character, body, and complexity? Would you immediately grab the Youngs just because? And why?

S.

it's a tendency, not a rule of thumb. at any given moment my beer fridge is likely to have just as many lagers as ales. in the case of similar profiles i'd probably have both :D the preference really stems from liking the fruity esters of ale yeast and has nothing to do with not liking lagers. there are even times where i'd go with the lager just based on which lager.

[b3s]

Originally posted by steveh
An interesting idea. Is LS pretty good with prices and shipping?

S.

http://www.liquidsolutions.biz/main/

prices on beers i can get locally are fairly comparable. they do ups ground or 2nd day, which usually isn't too bad.

[b3s]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Maybe someday... that's more money than I can spend on beer right now. But it's a good idea for sometime in the future! (Besides, what do we do - split the crate in half, too?)

lol, didn't think of that...tell ya what, i'll rochambeau you over it...

I would think that Fullers 1845 might be the best choice

noticed you skipped right over the belgians :p

[steveh]

Originally posted by b3s
in the case of similar profiles i'd probably have both

Well, yeah - that was inferred anyway! ;)

the preference really stems from liking the fruity esters of ale yeast

That's why I chose the 2 beers I did, the Youngs isn't really high in esters for an ale, and the Paulaner is more-so for a lager - they're really similar in malt character - the Paulaner maybe even being more fruity or whiney - more from malt and alcohol than yeast, of course.

there are even times where i'd go with the lager just based on which lager.

But see, you're really saying you're basing choice on experience with the beer, and that's more understandable than just knee-jerking on an "ale" title. After all, Paulaner Okto has "Ale" stamped on its label. ;-)

S.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by b3s

noticed you skipped right over the belgians
Not really; I just think that this close to the wire 1845 would be a better choice this time due to availability. A nice Chimay might be a good idea next, as it's getting colder here, and I always tend to think of them towards the holidays. 'Twould be very nice to have Richard along for the ride as well.

Hey steveh - a PU is sounding better and better for breakfast... :D

[Beaver]

Originally posted by steveh

That's why I chose the 2 beers I did, the Youngs isn't really high in esters for an ale, and the Paulaner is more-so for a lager - they're really similar in malt character - the Paulaner maybe even being more fruity or whiney - more from malt and alcohol than yeast, of course.


Who wants a beer that whines at you? ;)

[chazwicke]

You guys choose and I'm in. (1845 would be good though).

I am kind of like B3s (congrats on the big 1000 buddy!). I will usually go for the ale too. Not always, but usually. My choices would be made based on experience as well. I'm not that apt to grab an Old Nick or a Salvator. They are a usually a bit more than what I am in the mood for. Taste is so subjective. Since I am usually only having one or two at a givin sitting I usually choose a style that I am in the mood for and then evaluate the choices. This practice goes mainly for home consumption. When at a brewpub or bar, I like to sample several of their different offerings. Often I will try what ever seasonal or cask that is available.

[chazwicke]

Also, I would like to send a bottle of a certain rare beer that I have obtained ( You have one Steveh) to those who regularly attend the online tastings and hold a specialized tasting at some point. It would be a good winter beer. So after the next few tastings I'll send the regulars a bottle and we can do a tasting with it.

[fretlessman71]

Updated poll here! Vote early; vote often! (http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&postid=50259#post50259) :D

[steveh]

Originally posted by Beaver
Who wants a beer that whines at you? ;)

Hah. The 'h' must have been a keyboard reflex!

S.

[b3s]

Originally posted by chazwicke
When at a brewpub or bar, I like to sample several of their different offerings. Often I will try what ever seasonal or cask that is available.

heh, when at a brewpub i usually order a sampler platter and take notes...that way i can remember which one i liked. otherwise, yeah, i like to go with a seasonal (non-wheat :P) or something i just can't get at home.