When to rack to secondary...

[corysdad]

This batch is 6 days in primary and bubbling about once every 30 seconds. Should I wait till bubbling has completly stopped before racking to secondary? This is a Fuggles IPA 5 gal. Brewed from Midwest Brewing Kit.

[brewmonkey]

You can go ahead and rack it now. You can also wait until the bubbles stop but that actually might be some time as the beer degasses. Another good reason to rack while there is still some activity is that you will still be giving off CO2 and that will help form a protective layer in secondary to ward off the chances of oxidation.

[corysdad]

Thanks Brewmonkey, I will probably rack tonite. May I also ask about checking gravity, I sampled this same batch with what was left in the bottom of the brew pot, I read it at 1.073 at 75 degrees. Does this sound right? I thought it should have been around 1.042. I don't understand the hydrometer yet.

[Tom C]

I usually rack from my primary 1-2 weeks (tops) from initial fermentation.

[stronk]

Were you doing a full-wort boil, or did you do the boil and then add water to it when it was in the fermenter?

[O2 Mash]

Good point Stronk, never thought of that.

By the way, Corysdad makes me think of another related question. I was thinking that perhaps his readings were off because he measured the wort with excess sediment in the bottom of his brewpot. Does anyone know if this sediment can throw off a reading? I've often wondered that as I peer through my hydrometer vial and see sediment floating around.

[Fast_Eddy]

Originally posted by O2 Mash
Good point Stronk, never thought of that.

By the way, Corysdad makes me think of another related question. I was thinking that perhaps his readings were off because he measured the wort with excess sediment in the bottom of his brewpot. Does anyone know if this sediment can throw off a reading? I've often wondered that as I peer through my hydrometer vial and see sediment floating around.

Things you can see(ie not in solution) do not affect hydrometer readings.

[corysdad]

This was a partial boil 2.5 gals added to 2.5 gals.of water in the fermenting bucket. There was alot of hops and stuff in the sample, maybe 1.5 inches in the bottom. Is this throwing the reading off ? Or is this going to be a really big beer?

[YamahaXS]

Originally posted by corysdad
This was a partial boil 2.5 gals added to 2.5 gals.of water in the fermenting bucket. There was alot of hops and stuff in the sample, maybe 1.5 inches in the bottom. Is this throwing the reading off ? Or is this going to be a really big beer?

Their website provides this list of ingredients:
Our ingredients for this recipe include 6 Ibs. gold malt extract, 1 lb. caravienne malt,

unless you added a bunch of sugar, or some more extract than what came with the kit, then there is no way this will be a 1.072 OG. chalk it up to user error :)

The target OG (1.045ish) should be pretty close.

My guess is that you didn't stir your wort well after you added the water, or you didn't actually add as much water as you think (in which case you will have a big ass beer).

[O2 Mash]

Actually, you said this was a 2.5 gallon boil added to 2.5 gallons of water. If you took the hydrometer sample from the boil pot before you added any water, your reading would obviously be high. The wort that you boiled is very concentrated giving it a high gravity reading. If you would have taken the reading when you had the wort and water together, you would have found your reading to be much lower.

[stronk]

I don't understand the hydrometer yet
Here's the way I see it:
pure water has a certain density (density, I think, is directly related to specific gravity) and things will float in it at a certain level, depending on the make-up of the floaty thingy. If you add sugar or salt to the water, it becomes more dense and the floaty thingy floats a bit higher. The difference in heights corresponds to the difference in densities of the pure water and the sugar/salt water.

Luckily for us homebrewers, clever scientists have done all the experimenting and have worked out how density of wort at different stages of fermentation corresponds to the composition of the wort in terms of dissolved sugars and dissolved fermentation products. The equation they came up with (I think) is:

Final alcohol content (by volume) = (starting gravity - final gravity) x 0.133
Where gravity is measured in figures 1000 and upwards (not 1.000 and upwards).

The original gravity reading (OG) you got was wrong, so you'll have to assume the OG was what you expected it to be when you work out the final alcohol content of the beer.

[stronk]

PS:

Things you can see(ie not in solution) do not affect hydrometer readings.I have accepted that in the past, but I think that bubbles stuck to the sides of the hydrometer will affect the reading, so carbonated beer should be allowed (or induced) to go flat before a reading is taken.

[Fast_Eddy]

Originally posted by stronk
PS:

I have accepted that in the past, but I think that bubbles stuck to the sides of the hydrometer will affect the reading...

Quite right.

Clarification: Non-gaseous material suspended in a liquid will not affect the specific gravity.

[corysdad]

You guys are very right, I did take the sample from the consentrated wort. Wadda dummie. Will do better next time. I racked to secondary last night, sample was 1.010 at 72 degrees. Sure do learn alot from you guys,thanks alot.

[Steve16823]

Originally posted by corysdad
You guys are very right, I did take the sample from the consentrated wort. Wadda dummie. Will do better next time. I racked to secondary last night, sample was 1.010 at 72 degrees. Sure do learn alot from you guys,thanks alot.

It's no big deal, really. Since you only added water, which by definition has a S.G. of 1.000, you can calculate your original gravity by taking the average gravity of your mixture: OG = (1.000 + 1.073)/2 (of course, first correct the 1.073 for temperature)

Also... someone commented on the relationship between specific gravity and density. Specific Gravity is density expressed as a ratio to the density of water.

[stronk]

And I suppose, for something like 1 part conc. wort in 2 parts water, you'd have: [OG=(1.073 + 2(1.000))/3] ?

[orb]

Sorry guys.....I have no interest in specific gravity. In over fifteen years of brewing, I've found it a completely useless enterprise. For example, this week end I will Brew another Wheat Beer. I will boil 6 Pounds Wheat DME and 1 OZ Hallertau for 1 1/2 hours/cool to 74 degrees and pitch a Wyeast XL smack pack (3068)......I'll atttach a blow off for three days and then move to standard airlock. It will sit for 7 -10 days-then be racked to secondary for UP TO A MONTH!!!!. All ya need to know is how much fermentable material you have boiled, the yeast you are using, and you can figure out the alcohol content of your primed beer.......Why the hell would you bother with a Hydrometer ( and risk contamination ). Keep Brewing simple....It is supposed to be fun remember. I defy anyone to explain to me the neccesity of knowing the Original Gravity of a beer in the carboy....Jeff

[danno]

Jeff, for extract, I agree, you really don't need to know. For AG, however, it's a neccesity.

And, if you go get one of those $60 refractometers(Northern Brewer (http://www.northernbrewer.com/) has them on their front page), you'll never again complain about taking a reading or worry about whether you read the top or the bottom of the miniscus... it's sooo easy and quick, and you don't have to degas the sample, or worry about temperature correction, etc...

[orb]

Cool.......Which leads me to wonder......I have tried to convince myself that I need to compel myself to move to all grain brewing and it's requisite over complexity. I make bread, but I have no interest in grinding flour. I swear to the beer gods ( and they can confirm) that the extract ( Liquid and DME), premium yeasts and hops, and impeccable sanitation make all grain brewing too much blah blah blah....

[O2 Mash]

Nothing wrong with that at all. Why do something you don't want to do? For me, I enjoy the satisfaction and challenge of making beer "from scratch". Yes, it is a PITA, but it's also twice as much fun (for me)

[Steve16823]

As another extract brewer, I also agree with orb. About half the time I forget to check either OG or FG. And I never take intermediate samples -- too much trouble and too much sanitation risk.

I could see how it might be more critical with slow-fermenting lagers, to make sure fermentation is complete.

[orb]

Originally posted by Steve16823
As another extract brewer, I also agree with orb. About half the time I forget to check either OG or FG. And I never take intermediate samples -- too much trouble and too much sanitation risk.

I could see how it might be more critical with slow-fermenting lagers, to make sure fermentation is complete.

Yep....All this OG and final FG is BS. Adjust your fermentables and yeast and its attenuation and you know how strong your beer is and when to bottle it. I can't fathom f@#$#$ing with a Gravitometer and relying on it to tell me when to bottle ( or keg). You bottle when fermentation is complete in the secondary (or keg)...... 1 month in the secondary is not too long ( I know, long time-so brew more often) The yeast has gone into suspension, and comes alive when you add sterilized sugar to produce enough CO2 to carbonate your beer. Three weeks at 70 degrees/2 weeks cold condition-you have magic

[stronk]

Well, it's no risk to me, as I use buckets and can just take a sample out through the tap. What if you have a stuck fermentation? Then you'd be endangering yourself and the beer if you bottled it based on airlock activity.

I also often use anonymous yeast which has no data, so I can't tell attenuation. This is also true of some extracts, which don't tell you how much of them is fermentable.

That said, I agree that a hydrometer isn't vital, but it does give me an excuse to taste the beer (whenever I draw a sample to measure).

[Fast_Eddy]

Originally posted by orb
Yep....All this OG and final FG is BS. Adjust your fermentables and yeast and its attenuation and you know how strong your beer is and when to bottle it. I can't fathom f@#$#$ing with a Gravitometer and relying on it to tell me when to bottle ( or keg). You bottle when fermentation is complete in the secondary (or keg)...... 1 month in the secondary is not too long ( I know, long time-so brew more often) The yeast has gone into suspension, and comes alive when you add sterilized sugar to produce enough CO2 to carbonate your beer. Three weeks at 70 degrees/2 weeks cold condition-you have magic

A hydrometer is a widely adopted tool for brewing. It's simple to use and gives a brewer an easy way to understand what the current state of his/her beer is. Hitting gravities is very important in being able to reproduce the same beer time and again - not as important to extract brewers but still good information to know.

[Caffinehog]

Orb, don't fear the mash tun. You don't have to sanitize anything that won't touch the beer after it's boiled. And if you batch sparge, it's pretty simple. The biggest problem is getting a kettle big enough to do a full-wort boil.... and being able to heat that much liquid.