Beer I dislike / Beers I like.

[the4th]

Things I don't like:

1) Hoppy beers.

Call it the Scot in me, but I prefer maltier beers. I don't mind a good bitter finish to a crisp, clean lager (that's the German side of me I guess), but I don't like floral hoppiness like in Sam Adams or that gagging Cascade / Centennial / Amarillo hop flavor and aroma that permeates so many American Pale Ales on the market.

2) Wheat beers.

I've never met a Hefeweizen I liked. Or a Weizen, Weisse, Wit, or a Kolsch beer yet for that matter. There is something just not quite right about them. Not quite an egginess... but something I just can't quite put my finger on. I gag when I attempt to drink them. (And get that lemon away from my beer!)

3) North American Macrobrews...

Molson, Moosehead, Pabst Blue Ribbon, Budweiser, Miller, Pearl, Hamms, Cooks, Schlitz, Old Style.... the list goes on and on and on. They all just weird. Some have a nice smooth start but get funky quick. Most have some of the worst aftertastes ever. Burnt corn? BLECH! And Lord forbid you let them get above 40 degrees. The only exceptions I've found that I can drink in quantity (like while doing yardwork or hanging out in my buddy's garage) are Keystone LIGHT and Busch LIGHT. (With a STRONG preference to Keystone Light.) The normal versions of those are as bad as anything else listed. I find these two to be slightly sweeter on the palate with very clean, non-bitter finishes. Pefect for slugging down to cool off or wash down a hotdog.


Things I do like:

Malty ales.

As listed above, I do like maltier beers. Skullsplitter is my favorite special occasion beer although at times it CAN be a bit salty for me. (Soy sauce is the flavor that's been used by friends.)

Newcastle Brown Ale could be my "daily drinker." It's got a great lightly malty body and slight bitter finish and poof... it's gone from your palate. (My first batch of beer was a Newcastle attempt but ended up a little more buttery and sour due to high fermentation temps.... still good though! ;) )


Clean, crisp, no lingering aftertaste Lagers.

I LOVE Abita Golden. I have been known to drink pitchers of Michelob Light and Ultra. As long as there is no weird aftertastes, I can be happy drinking most any beer on a hot night out with friends.


Fruit beers.

Yes, I admit it. I LOVE a good sweet beer. Just not the ones based heavily on wheat. That gagging taste still comes through on me. Even Leinenkugel's super sweet Berryweiss gags me. (It's my wife's favorite, I just can't get it in Texas.) The only exception to a sweet beer with lots of wheat that I can drink are Lindemans (and similar) Lambics.

I'll be experimenting with making a light sweet raspberry ale in the next couple of weeks. Here's the recipe I found if anyone wants to try it. I'll most assuredly be adding the lactose and / or some Splenda.

Raspberry Relief
• 7 lb. Munton's plain light dry malt
• 1/2 lb. 20L crystal malt
• 1-1/2 oz. Hallertau hops (boil)
• 1/2 oz. Hallertau hops (finishing)
• 46 oz. Oregon Raspberry Puree
• Wyeast #1338 European Ale
• 1 tsp. Irish Moss
Steep crushed crystal malt in cold water while heating to boil. Remove grain before boil. Add malt extract and 1 1/2 ounces Hallertau hops and boil for 45 minutes. Add Irish moss for the last 20 minutes of boil. (Rehydrate the Irish moss in 1/4 cup water overnight). At 45 minutes, turn off heat and add aroma hops. Cool down with wort chiller and rack into primary fermenter. Take and record the initial gravity reading. When the wort reaches 70 degrees pitch the yeast. (We recommend using a yeast starter). After two days, rack into secondary fermenter and add fruit puree. Ferment for 7 to 14 days. When your hydrometer reading shows no change for two to three days, bottle. Use 1/2 to 3/4 cups priming sugar. Beer is drinkable in one month if you like “zippy” fruit beers., Aging 6 to 8 months will let the raspberry mellow
Options: Add 2 to 4 ounces lactose before bottling to mellow raspberries.


What do you not like in a beer?

[newportstorm]

Holy crap!:eek: Is this bizzaro world? You're my total opposite. Wits, dark hefes, hoppy IPAs/IIPAs and barleywines are some of my favorite styles. Hell, even a macro like Stroh's or PBR is welcome over a Lindeman's Framboise (the Kriek's OK).

I do like some malty brews, esp. the Scotch Ales. Skullsplitter is nice, as are lots of Doppelbocks, Maibocks, Porters, etc. But I gotta say that Newcastle is almost as bland as some American macros. There's just nothing going on in that brew, imo.

I've rarely (ever?) met a fruit beer that I really enjoy aside from fruit lambics like Boon and Cantillon. Blueberry beers seem to be popular in New England, and I do try them if I see a new one, but most have failed me.

Guess we should be thankful that there are enough beer styles and different interpretations of such to keep us both happy!

Cheers!

[HarkJohnny]

so interesting how everyone has a love of something and the next person is the exact opposite.

I expect and crave that hops smell, flavor and bite. Malty is OK, but I just don't like a weak finish. Hefe's and lighter tasting (not lite) beers just don't do it for me.

I have a theory that hopheads enjoy spicier foods too. Me, I've only found 1 salsa that absolutely killed me so far... José Madrid's XXX Salsa Verde. Other than that I order things "the hottest you've got" when eating spicy foods. Thai, chicken wings, mexican...whatever.

[the4th]

I'm from Texas. My kids even eat foods that make most grown men cry from the heat. Thai, Mexican, Cajun, we love it all HOT!

Boo to hops! ;)

[skahtboi]

Originally posted by the4th
I'm from Texas. My kids even eat foods that make most grown men cry from the heat. Thai, Mexican, Cajun, we love it all HOT!

Boo to hops! ;)

I, too, am from Texas. My friends and family indulge in spicy foods, and I have found that nearly everyone I know who likes "real beer" like hoppier beers with these foods. Even my wife, who normally won't touch an American pale ale, will request one when eating some of my etouffe or jambalaya.

I personally like all the types of beer listed in this thread. Some more than others.

[IPAfanatic]

Newport, I agree with you almost whole-heartedly. Ever since my first IPA I cant get enough hops!! I almost completely gave up the rancid macrobrews and now buy anything that says IPA or has a picture of hops on the bottle!
However, I disagree with Hank. While I am a hop junky, I can't handle spicy foods. Pretty much anything hotter than medium salsa is just too much. However, nothing puts out that spicy fire like a potent IPA.

Cheers!

[HarkJohnny]

Originally posted by IPAfanatic
However, I disagree with Hank. While I am a hop junky, I can't handle spicy foods. Pretty much anything hotter than medium salsa is just too much. However, nothing puts out that spicy fire like a potent IPA.

damn... there goes that theory... well I figured somone would disprove it anyway.

p.s. it's Hark, not Hank.... but I'll give the benefit of doubt seeing as you're new. ;)

[tyesai]

I was never/still not a big hop head. But those IPA's with a rich malty flavor then hop taste kick ass.

[hopjack13]

Originally posted by the4th
Things I don't like:

1) Hoppy beers
2) Wheat beers.

Yes, I admit it. I LOVE a good sweet beer
The only exception to a sweet beer with lots of wheat that I can drink are Lindemans (and similar) Lambics.

I'll be experimenting with making a light sweet raspberry ale in the next couple of weeks.


hey are you a chick?
i think a true beer lover enjoys a large variety of styles.
i try to stay open to different style, although i admit there are a few (i wont say dislike) that i do not understand completely.

[chazwicke]

Originally posted by skahtboi
I personally like all the types of beer listed in this thread. Some more than others.

I'm with Scott on this.

[fretlessman71]

I would never presume to say who is ans isn't a "true beer drinker", but I will say that there are good and bad examples of every style of beer out there, and it wasn't until I tried a Flying Dog Wheat that I decided I'd give wheat beer another chance. (It actually tasted like wheat... go figure!) So maybe there are other examples of beers we don't like that we need to explore. I think I would enjoy just about anything DONE WELL... proper balance of flavors and whatnot. A friend of mine gave me a pint of an ESB he brewed, but with peated crystal malt... WOW! What a change! Not sure if I'd make one, but it was by far the most interesting beer I'd ever had.

Maybe successful quaffing can be summed up by the old standby phrase: "It's the journey, not the destination." Or, more accurately put, "It's the joy of trying something new every bit as much as the enjoyment of an old standby."

[hopjack13]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
I would never presume to say who is ans isn't a "true beer drinker"

if you are referring to my earlier post i never said anyone one was or was not a true beer drinker, what i said was i think a true beer lover enjoys a large variety of styles.
or maybe i should rephrase it and say that any beer aficionado learns to appreciates a wide range of different styles.
beer comes in soo many different flavors , styles, cultural and ethnic backgrounds and with so much history to it, i think anyone would be short changing themselve by sticking to just a few styles.
sometimes you have to learn to like different styles (i did with barlywines)
100 brewerys could make the same style beer and not one of them would be exactly the same. so the odds are you may find at least one you like, or can tolerate.
mgd is a lager, i hate mgd. however i would short change myself if i said i hate all lagers sence there are some damn fine ones out there.

[the4th]

Originally posted by hopjack13
hey are you a chick?



Sniff... sniff... sniff ... what? No I'm not crying... just trying to figure out that smell. Oh yeah! It's jackass!

:p


What sparked this rant was that I had a bomber of Avery's The Beast last night and then finished a bottle each of Sierra Nevada Bigfoot, and North Coast Brewery's Old Stock Ale (2003).

Due to my experiences with Scotch, I think my palate is just picky on some nights. Some nights I can drink Lagavulin, other nights I can't take anything heavier than a Glenlivet.

I'm not saying I can't appreciate what brewers are trying to do with certain beers, I can taste the banana and clove and yeast flavors in a well made Hefeweizen, I can taste the enormous amounts of hops in certain brews and although I'm new to it, can identify a few, I just don't like them. I used to do dairy judging in HS and food judging after that for a couple of years at the county fair. I ate a lot of stuff I didn't like, but learned to judge things based on certain criteria (texture, moisture, richness of flavor, appropriateness of ingredients for a certain style, etc) and even awarded some first place ribbons to things that gagged me.

There are times I've sat and had a Sierra Nevada Pale Ale or Full Sail Ale with buddies and enjoyed them, but I would have rather knocked back a draught Guinness.

I LOVE Stouts and Porters of all types. Chocolate, Milk, sweet, dry, fruited, whatever... even some Imperials if they aren't too hoppy.

[hops99]

hey are you a chick?

Almost spit out my GL Dortmunder...Hopjack, don't sugar-coat it, alright? ;)

I've found myself getting bored with extreme-hopped beers lately, and appreciating balance in beer more. For example, while the original interpretation of an IPA shouldn't have much (if any) malt presence, I can't get enough Victory HopDevil, or other big beers (big meaning hops AND malt). I'm also enjoying the subtle flavors of a well-crafted lager more lately (i.e. Penn Dark, Spaten Optimator, Great Lakes Eliot Ness, etc.).

For me, I think beer is cyclical. There isn't any one variety or style of beer that I don't like (except macro crap, of course - but then, that isn't really beer, now is it?). I keep going through the cycles, where I might prefer hops over malt for a year or so, then move back to maltier offerings, then get into more experimental brews, then back to fruit beers, and on and on.

That's why I love craft beer so much - the variety is stunning....

[hopjack13]

Originally posted by the4th
Sniff... sniff... sniff ... what? No I'm not crying... just trying to figure out that smell. Oh yeah! It's jackass!
then you should close your window, i thought texas was known for their cattle not their jackass's?
look, i wasn't trying to insult you by asking if you were a chick? there was nothing in your screen name or post that indicated wether you were male or female, and when you said you didn't like hoppie beers but loved fruity beers it made me wonder, thats all, an honest mistake. so relax and have a brew!
i could actually go for a bridge port ipa right now!
as far as beers and what i don't like in them hmmm.... i don't like corn , rice , cereal grains and most beers with adjuncts i could do without. i usually stick to the basic four. however triples seem to be the exception as i have a real sweet tooth for them.
and then there is the speedway stout that is brewed with coffe beans, i like that one a lot!

[hopjack13]

Originally posted by hops99
Almost spit out my GL Dortmunder...Hopjack, don't sugar-coat it, alright?
i guess i could have been a little more subtle...
but i'm with ya on the cycle thing hops99
i almost hopped myself out last month, just didn't care for anything real hoppy....well lets say pacific nw hops, i switched over to the saaz in the urquell. and actually the month before i was on a bit of a malt binge, i think im moving back to the hops again though.
hopdevil is great, it has both. also the alphaking is right up there with it imo, although it's been a while sence i had one.....:(

[wortchillergoal]

I think some of this ties in to the thread that is titled overlooked.

I enjoy a large variety of beers. Yet, there are some styles I prefer over others. I will try a beer reguardless of style if someone tells me it is good. I will also try a beer out of pure curiousity if the name grabs me right.

I find the comments about barelywines interesting. My wife and I both enjoy that as our favorite style. She likes hers to have a good malt body as in when it as aged for some time. I actually like to get it while it still has a good hop to malt balance or even a little heavy on hops then try it again after aging.

I think most beer people I know can tell a good beer from a non good beer. We all just have things we would rather drink.

Final thought, try a real heavy hopped beer right after a good sweat.

[dennis3951]

i don't consider myself a hophead, but i like a strong hop presence in my beer. The only group or style i don't like is fruit beer.The only fruit beer that i ever truely enjoyed was at my local brew pub about 2 years ago . The brewer threw about 20 lbs of peeled apriocots in with his malt, the result was outstanding. It was a nice beer to drink by itself but was even better with seafood.

[steveh]

Originally posted by the4th
Things I don't like:

2) Wheat beers.

I've never met a Hefeweizen I liked. Or a Weizen, Weisse, Wit, or a Kolsch beer yet for that matter. There is something just not quite right about them. Not quite an egginess... but something I just can't quite put my finger on. I gag when I attempt to drink them. (And get that lemon away from my beer!)

Egginess? I'm sure you're referring to a sulfur aroma, or DMS, though I can't remember sampling a Weizen that ever had a strong sulfuric character.

Kolsch isn't a wheat beer and should not have any similar character to a Weizen or Wit. Small amounts of wheat malt are sometimes used in brewing a Kolsch, but it's usually used for head retention, not flavor characteristics. And the ester bi-products of the fermented yeast are completely different in these 2 beers.

But I'm with ya on the lemon.

Clean, crisp, no lingering aftertaste Lagers.

Beer is supposed to have aftertsate. Most of my favorite lagers have a lingering malt aftertaste - helles and bock alike.

S.

[the4th]

Originally posted by steveh
Egginess? I'm sure you're referring to a sulfur aroma, or DMS, though I can't remember sampling a Weizen that ever had a strong sulfuric character.

Kolsch isn't a wheat beer and should not have any similar character to a Weizen or Wit. Small amounts of wheat malt are sometimes used in brewing a Kolsch, but it's usually used for head retention, not flavor characteristics. And the ester bi-products of the fermented yeast are completely different in these 2 beers.


I'm pretty sensitive to sulfur tastes and can't say that's what I'm tasting. I can't quite peg the flavor that's there. I use eggy because it reminds me of the flavor / mouthfeel of the egg yolk from a sunnyside up egg.

Perhaps I've had too limited an exposure to Kolsch beers. The couple I tried were just too wheaty. One was from Shiner brewery here in Texas. I've not been overly impressed with their other products, so it doesn't surprise me that I was displeased with their Kolsch.

Originally posted by steveh

Beer is supposed to have aftertsate. Most of my favorite lagers have a lingering malt aftertaste - helles and bock alike.


When I say clean, I don't mean flavorless, I mean clean. I agree that beer needs a FINISH, but not a lingering aftertaste. I don't want burnt corn, perfume, or floral notes hanging around long after I swallow. Blech! Maltiness, a slight bitterness, even a floral note from some odd hoppy beer, but I want it gone quickly. Why on earth would I want to take another drink when I'm still tasting the first? ;)

[steveh]

Originally posted by the4th
Why on earth would I want to take another drink when I'm still tasting the first? ;)

That's exactly why, most of us find that aftertaste enticing us to the next sip. All of those old marketing trends for "beer with no aftertatse" by the macros, some years ago, always cracked me up - also the ads slamming "bitter beer." Beer is supposed to be bitter, you flavorless, swill touting mopes (the macros, that is).

Yeah, give some more Kolschs a chance - I've never compared them to Wheats. I have a friend who dislikes Wheats almost as much as you, but Kolschs are one of his favorite styles.

S.

[marksalehouse]

"Coldflow" Guinness is disgusting. It is served at way below what Guinness is normally served at. Why? because it is bad stuff and the coldness hides the crap it is.

This is from a dedicated Guinness drinker brought up on the bottled stuff (when it was sedimented) some 37 years ago.

Mark

[the4th]

I figured it out!!!!

I recently brewed a honey blonde ale and for the first (and last) time used the recommended Kolsch yeast. I kegged it a few days ago and just went to the kegerator, pulled a small glass from the tap, tasted it, and nearly hurled. It tastes just like every other wheat and kolsch beer I've ever tried. It's a taste like when tea goes bad. That rancid flavor. I've been tasting beers like that for years and never could peg it, but for some reason it hit me like a truck today. Rancid tea. Blech.

So.... now I have 5 gallons of nasty non-wheat wheat beer to try and choke down. Oh well... maybe some people at my friend's bachelor party next weekend will like it.

[fretlessman71]

Three words: Beer Bread; Cooking. It's not a wasted effort. And who knows - it may age a bit and improve by the time you're down to the last pint or so. What a drag!

[Jinja]

Why, yes, yes I am. And "chicks" don't always drink raspberry beers or Smirnoff Ice I'll have you know.

That said, I prefer malt over hops. And I've had a DIPA or two or seven, but give me a smooth brown ale or a rich amber or a marzen and I'll enjoy that over a harshly hopped beer any day.

Not that I don't admire the skill of craft of highly-hopped beers, but when it comes right down to it, it's what you like that matters. I can rag on the Bud and Miller drinkers till the cows come home, but hey - if that's what they like, it makes them happy and they have a good time, I'm all for it. Just don't serve it to me :)

Jinja Out

[wortchillergoal]

I put some thought in to this and have arrived at the following.

Beer I dislike- The beer I can't find.

Beer I like- Tie- The beer I am having now/ the next beer I will have.

[fretlessman71]

Did someone ask if you were? I couldn't find it. Doesn't matter anyway... as long as you love good beer and love talking about good beer, you'll make fast friends here.

BTW..... yes, "chicks" DO only like Smirnoff Ice and Apricot Ale... it's part of the stigma. Kinda like "NASCAR fans" drinking Bud because that way they don't have to taste anything to get drunk, you know? :D OTOH, "females" can drink pretty much anything the "males" drink (although not as much in a sitting - proven fact, you know). Enjoy what you like, and welcome to the board!

[wortchillergoal]

In regards to females and this board, Welcome. We like anyone who can discuss beer. I believe from another thread or two, many males of this commuinty have a female in their life who likes good beer, mine being one.

[fretlessman71]

Still working on the female from mine... she seemed to like the wit from Odell's some when I gave her a taste, but not enough yet to have a glass for herself. Maybe next time I'll get the fruit ale (I think it's Apricot right now) from Big Horn - seems to be more up her alley (ergo, she is an official "chick", if you know what I mean! :D ).

[Jinja]

Heh

I can actually "outdrink" my guy - and he's no lightweight!

Gotta be an exception to every rule, I guess!

Jinja Out

[fretlessman71]

Exceptions? Yeah, like me - 33 yrs old, 200 pounds, and 2 beers is my limit.... you'd think I'd have developed a tolerance by now! Oh well... saves me from several potentially embarrassing situations: "I don't NEED a license to drink when I'm driving, Ossifer..." :D

[staronstage]

Hello everyone, I'm the "guy" in Jinja's life. You know, the one she thinks she can outdrink? :) Oh okay, I'll be honest, she can. In fact she is the Jedi Master who taught me the ways of the Beer Force.

Likes:
I find myself really drawn to hops recently. I love my malty browns ... mmmm ACME: Brown. But I love a good Double (Imperial) IPA (i.e. Marin: White Knuckle Ale or Hoptown: D.U.I.P.A).

And those crazy Belgian's make me so happy. Or at least a Belgian style ale, such as North Coast: Pranqster.

Dislikes
Pilsners. I want to be opened minded I really do. There are so many out there, and I have yet to find one I like. Not even the great Gordon Biersch's (who I la-huve) Pilsner is tasty.

[the4th]

Ok.... I figured out the problem with the Honey Beer done w/ Kolsch yeast.

It's just a bad batch of beer. Don't know what infected it but I think it came from my old demijohn carboy. It's been sitting around for years (gift from my cousin) and I THOUGHT I cleaned all the dirt and crud out of it. I guess I missed a spot.

[steveh]

Originally posted by staronstage
Dislikes
Pilsners. I want to be opened minded I really do. There are so many out there, and I have yet to find one I like. Not even the great Gordon Biersch's (who I la-huve) Pilsner is tasty.

You need to educate and sophisticate you palate - just ask Fretless. Anyone can drink an Imperial Stout, or a Barleywine and say, "Yeah - that's a beer." It takes some concentration and attention to savor a good Pilsner. Start with a Czechvar or Golden Pheasant and work up to a Pilsner Urquell. We'll have you enjoying more beer than you can count in no time!

S.

More good reading (http://www.lewbryson.com/buzzin.htm)

[staronstage]

I agree, it is easy for new converts to be convinced that only "big" beers are quality. I don't think that is the case here, I have pretty varied tastes. I enjoy nearly every style I can think of, with the exception of the extra fruity lambics and the aforementioned pilsners.

I've had the Pilsner Urquell, and for my money it just doesn't have the flavor or feel that I want from a beer.

I am open to the idea though. And that's the first step. We are talking about the guy (me) who at one time thought that Madori Sours were the height of drinking! (sheesh that is embarrassing!)

[fretlessman71]

If it helps, I'm on a lager-only kick simply to re-educate my taste buds. The sweet tooth in me takes over all too often and steers me toward ales, and I can't seem to appreciate the subtlties (sp?) of lagers. Might be a good exercise to do, and just think how good your favorite ale will taste after a month off, too!

BTW... welcome to the board - both of you!

[the4th]

Ahhh... those sweet, subtle, light Lagers.....

EKU 28, Samichlaus, Paulaner Dopplebock, Sam Adams Triple Bock

[Theakston]

Originally posted by the4th
Ahhh... those sweet, subtle, light Lagers.....

EKU 28, Samichlaus, Paulaner Dopplebock, Sam Adams Triple Bock

Purple Tin (http://gk007a0336.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/tennents.htm) :eek:

[steveh]

Originally posted by the4th
Ahhh... those sweet, subtle, light Lagers.....

EKU 28, Samichlaus, Paulaner Dopplebock, Sam Adams Triple Bock

He he he he - beat me too it. ;) Though, Sam - using a Champagne yeast, might not really be able to call itself a Lager.

How subtle was that Schwarzbier Fret? You have a Capital Maibock (among other lagers) motoring your way too, give us some impressions.

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Theakston
Purple Tin (http://gk007a0336.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/tennents.htm) :eek:

Gotta say, I've never been a huge fan of the U.K. translation of the Lager style. Harp is okkay, but I don't go out of my way. Sam Smith's left me flat. I haven't had one in a while, so I can't pin-point the reason...maybe it's the new mission.

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by staronstage
I've had the Pilsner Urquell, and for my money it just doesn't have the flavor or feel that I want from a beer.

That's half the fun, and what can also be so wonderfully overwhelming: There are too many flavors in beer styles to feel you need to settle for a single style all the time.

S.

[aspiditesramsay]

Well I do not Dislike a GOOD beer of any style wheat or Kolsch included. But I do dislike a poorly done representation of any style.
although I do have preferences the more complexity the better.
Westvleteren 12 and Blonde, Bosteels Deus and Herold pilsner all come to mind. also love the Hops and with that SPICY food the spicier the better. Try Christoffel Blonde for a very hoppy pilsner or of course Pliny the Elder for a good Double Ipa. Beer is good
and beer can be very very very BAD.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by steveh

How subtle was that Schwarzbier Fret? You have a Capital Maibock (among other lagers) motoring your way too, give us some impressions.

S.
Definitely subtler than an ale of a similar color, New Belgium's 1554 notwithstanding. Inspired me to give the Fort Collins Doktor Lager (helles) and Edgar Lager (amber) a try, and they're both terrific! Who knows... I might even give up ales!


.......NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH! ;)

Seriously, though, I'll give a full report on anything and everything that I get a chance to taste in that box. The reports may not be standard form, but they'll be descriptive. Right now enjoying an Edgar Lager, and the malt notes are coming through strong - tastes a lot like that Paulaner Oktoberfest that has been well-spoken of on this board of late. Maybe you'll get some to compare, eh what?

[BluesHarp]

Originally posted by steveh
He he he he - beat me too it. Though, Sam - using a Champagne yeast, might not really be able to call itself a Lager.

How subtle was that Schwarzbier Fret? You have a Capital Maibock (among other lagers) motoring your way too, give us some impressions.

S.

Autumnal Fire should be right around the corner......:cool:

[Beaver]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Definitely subtler than an ale of a similar color, New Belgium's 1554 notwithstanding. Inspired me to give the Fort Collins Doktor Lager (helles) and Edgar Lager (amber) a try, and they're both terrific! Who knows... I might even give up ales!


.......NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH! ;)

Seriously, though, I'll give a full report on anything and everything that I get a chance to taste in that box. The reports may not be standard form, but they'll be descriptive. Right now enjoying an Edgar Lager, and the malt notes are coming through strong - tastes a lot like that Paulaner Oktoberfest that has been well-spoken of on this board of late. Maybe you'll get some to compare, eh what?

New Belgium lists 1554 as a Brussels Style Black Ale, but I would categorize it as a Schwarzbier. Here's their description:

Phil, our quality development whiz, stumbled onto Zwartbier in an 1888 British tome called The Popular Beverages of Various Countries. He and brewmaster Peter made two trips to Belgium to research this obscure style in the archives of Belgium's specialty brewers. The oldest reference to these black beers that our dynamic duo uncovered was the year 1554.

Other than being dark in color, 1554 has little in common with Porter or Stouts. The beer is fermented at relatively high temperatures using a European lager yeast that imparts a refreshing, zesty acidity. With 1554 our staff hoped to create an ale that would be easy to imagine as a beer served 446 years ago, but also a beer that doesn't ignore 446 years of brewing advancements.

FCB's Edgar is a Vienna style. It and Doktor are much more flavorful from tap rather than bottled.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by Beaver
New Belgium lists 1554 as a Brussels Style Black Ale, but I would categorize it as a Schwarzbier.
Wouldn't a Schwartzbier be a lager instead? And the NB description speaks to the higher fermentation temps used. I'm confused - just what is a schwarzbier, then? Ale? Lager? Neither one? What? What? WHAAAAAT??!?!?!??!?!

FCB's Edgar is a Vienna style. It and Doktor are much more flavorful from tap rather than bottled.
I think I'm ready to re-try them from the tap now. When I first visited the brewery, I had "hopped-out" taste buds and couldn't really appreciate the brews. The bottles I've had were very fresh and very good, so maybe it's time to head back for some Edgar! $5 growlers all month long - WOOHOO!!!! :D

[steveh]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Definitely subtler than an ale of a similar color,.

Cleaner, maybe - less esters and fruitiness - but it shouldn't have been subtle. The roasted malts should have dominated the nose and the same malts with Munich malts should have made a mouthful. Should have.

Who knows... I might even give up ales!

Now, you know that's never been suggested.

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Wouldn't a Schwartzbier be a lager instead? And the NB description speaks to the higher fermentation temps used. I'm confused - just what is a schwarzbier, then? Ale? Lager? Neither one? What? What? WHAAAAAT??!?!?!??!?!


Easy, easy - it's a Lager (http://www.bjcp.org/finalstyles/Category04.html), 4C.

And while 1554 might be a "revived" Belgian interpretation of the style, it's not at all similar to the Southern German style more readily recognized. Too many fruit esters going on from warm fermentation. Here (http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1518&highlight=New+Belgium+1554) are my notes on the beer from last October.

S.

[Beaver]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Wouldn't a Schwartzbier be a lager instead? And the NB description speaks to the higher fermentation temps used. I'm confused - just what is a schwarzbier, then? Ale? Lager? Neither one? What? What? WHAAAAAT??!?!?!??!?!


I think I'm ready to re-try them from the tap now. When I first visited the brewery, I had "hopped-out" taste buds and couldn't really appreciate the brews. The bottles I've had were very fresh and very good, so maybe it's time to head back for some Edgar! $5 growlers all month long - WOOHOO!!!! :D

Like Steve said, a Schwarzbier is a lager. The description for 1554 mentions using a lager yeast but fermenting at high temperatures, so I'm not sure what that does for it. That would make it similar to a Steam beer, which I think is usually categorized as a lager.

[Beaver]

Originally posted by steveh
Easy, easy - it's a Lager (http://www.bjcp.org/finalstyles/Category04.html), 4C.

And while 1554 might be a "revived" Belgian interpretation of the style, it's not at all similar to the Southern German style more readily recognized. Too many fruit esters going on from warm fermentation. Here (http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1518&highlight=New+Belgium+1554) are my notes on the beer from last October.

S.

I've never picked up any fruitiness from 1554 before. Maybe I'll have to revisit it soon.

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by Beaver
Like Steve said, a Schwarzbier is a lager. The description for 1554 mentions using a lager yeast but fermenting at high temperatures, so I'm not sure what that does for it. That would make it similar to a Steam beer, which I think is usually categorized as a lager.
That's what I thought too, but someone mentioned to me (after I professed my fondness for Flying Dog Old Scratch Amber Lager) that it was really a steam beer, and therefore not technically a lager. Can't use "steam beer" because Anchor owns that title, and "California Common" just sounds too pretentious, so what do we call this stuff?....

Maybe an Alelager? An auger? (Oh... taken. But apropos if it's strong enough, I suppose...) How about a Layle? Or a Lagale?

Drat... too much caffeine again... time for a beer... :D

[steveh]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
That's what I thought too, but someone mentioned to me (after I professed my fondness for Flying Dog Old Scratch Amber Lager) that it was really a steam beer, and therefore not technically a lager.

It may be fermented at a higher temp than usual for a lager, but it uses a lager yeast - and the odds are good that it's cool-stored for the second ferment, as well as maturing, these days.

I guess it depends on where you want to draw the "technical" line. Steam Beer eveolved as a result of more people desiring the new Lager style beer of the mid 19th century. Brewers got their hands on the yeast, but made the beer as best they could without the proper equipment facilities.

Can't use "steam beer" because Anchor owns that title, and "California Common" just sounds too pretentious, so what do we call this stuff?....

Call it Steam, Fritz be damned! ;)

just don't put it on your label!

S.

Jeez (http://www.bjcp.org/finalstyles/Category07.html), everything's changing these days - they now have CC under Amber Hybrid Beer, what the hell? Note the yeasts used, though.

[Beaver]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
That's what I thought too, but someone mentioned to me (after I professed my fondness for Flying Dog Old Scratch Amber Lager) that it was really a steam beer, and therefore not technically a lager. Can't use "steam beer" because Anchor owns that title, and "California Common" just sounds too pretentious, so what do we call this stuff?....

Maybe an Alelager? An auger? (Oh... taken. But apropos if it's strong enough, I suppose...) How about a Layle? Or a Lagale?

Drat... too much caffeine again... time for a beer... :D

I thnk that was me on the Old Scratch. Steve's link even lists it as an example for the CC!

Commercial Examples: Anchor Steam, Southampton West Coast Steam Beer, Old Dominion Victory Amber, Flying Dog Old Scratch Amber Lager

[fretlessman71]

Originally posted by steveh


Jeez (http://www.bjcp.org/finalstyles/Category07.html), everything's changing these days - they now have CC under Amber Hybrid Beer, what the hell? Note the yeasts used, though.

Guess I wasn't TOO far off, then, was I? Crazy....

[Jake]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Exceptions? Yeah, like me - 33 yrs old, 200 pounds, and 2 beers is my limit.... you'd think I'd have developed a tolerance by now! Oh well... saves me from several potentially embarrassing situations: "I don't NEED a license to drink when I'm driving, Ossifer..." :D

I'm 40 and 210 pounds and I put the brakes on at 3. I thought maybe it was because for the most part I only drank a six pack a year. That was until I made the discovery of the micro brew world earlier this year. I drink about a 6 pack a weekend now. I'm so new at this taste thing that I really don't know what I'm drinking is considered Hoppy or malty or something in between. Help me out. Here is what I have drank so far and liked: Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, Samuel Adams, Samuel Adams Octoberfest, Bells Pale Ale, Frankenmuth Pilsner. I did not care for Arcadia India Pale Ale (this assuming I did not have a bottle that went bad). Not keen on the several white Ale's I had especially the Elephant Hill Hefenpizen. I think I might enjoy white ale beers on very hot summer days (that would be about three days a year here in Michigan).

[Marcarc]

I really and truly have not met a beer I didn't like. I'm the same as the above poster, though I've been making beer kits for almost twenty years now it's mostly been to save money. I don't usually frequent the macrobrews simply because I prefer to support small business. I do buy Moosehead simply because it's from my old stompin ground of New Brunswick, Canada, and it is one of the best places to work in the province.
But honestly, I don't even know how to pick out the difference between 'hoppy' and 'malty'. Strangely enough, I actually almost like just being in a pub as much as the beer. There's just something beautiful about, say, a curly maple bar top with a mahogoney rail, and the beautifully turned tap. I'm not much of a traveller but I think I'd enjoy rating the most beautiful pubs of the world. On that note, I was in Dublin and sadly disappointed, the ones I frequented weren't much more original than the ones here in Canada. Long live the Horseshoe Tavern!

[fretlessman71]

The difference between hoppy and malty is bas basic as the difference between bitter and sweet. Go find a strong IPA like Dogfish Head 90 min. IPA and you'll be able to tell what hops taste like. An Oktoberfest like Capital should give you an idea of a good malt flavor. And that's the basic gist of it! It's a lot of fun trying to tell what makes a beer taste the way it does in this way - it really adds to my enjoyment of the brew! Welcome to the site!

[BluesHarp]

Ah, Fret...the beauty of Dogfish Head 90 Min. is the balance of the malt and the hops...they are both there in abundance!;) ...but your point is well taken!

A Scottish ale is nearly all malt, very few hops, though some are smoky as well; that would be another good example of a malty beer.

As for hoppy, Sierra Nevada, which Jake is familiar with is a good hoppy beer, as are most pale or India pale ales.
Bell's Two-Hearted Ale is a very highly regarded beer that is quite hoppy.

Malt has sweetness, hops lend bitterness as well as flavors and aromas ranging from citrus to pine to floral to spicy.

You can sort of think of malt as the "meat" in your beer entree, with hops being the "spices" that give it it's particular character...the best meals have just the right amount of each.

[Concrete Blonde]

Originally posted by BluesHarp
Ah, Fret...the beauty of Dogfish Head 90 Min...

*CB perks up*

Did someone say Dogfish Head ?? :D

Drat it all, I just realized I have to board a plane back to reality (and my job to pay for all the plunder I acquired while shopping) day after tomorrow and I still have not had my Immort Ale. :-( No can buy in Oregon.

Sympathy cards can be sent to.... :P~~~~~~~~

[fretlessman71]

A few bottles will fit neatly in your luggage, won't they? Put them in Ziploc bags if you must... it's gotta be safer than trusting a beer package to the USPS, and I haven't had one break yet (although I'm still trying to figure out what happened to the package I sent steveh that somehow LEAKED without any seals failing...)

[chazwicke]

Put them in your carry on luggage. I've had them leak in my suitcase before in the un pressurized baggage compartment.

[fretlessman71]

I wonder if I should specify ground shipping next time I send a package, then... steveh's beer sure got there fast; dare I say too fast to be safe for travelling liquids....?

[Concrete Blonde]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
A few bottles will fit neatly in your luggage, won't they?

Originally posted by chazwicke
Put them in your carry on luggage.


You guys don't understand...my INCOMING luggage got slapped with the big orange HEAVY sticker on it and now I've been shopping...first there was Vail, then Cherry Creek Mall, (which ain't no trip to the Five and Dime), then Colorado Mills...I am going to have to make a trip (and I am NOT making this up) to the UPS Store just to get all the "stuff" I purchased back home. :rolleyes:

Perhaps I could roll a few bottles of DFHIA among the VS and the AF, but the whole point was really to drink it while in CO. >:-)

[chazwicke]

Hey you gotta think of what is more important...........Beer.........other purchases.......Beer........



I always travel with a suitcase a bit larger than I need so I have room to bring stuff back.