Downtown Chicago

[Payson]

I'm going to be staying in downtown Chicago near the "Navy Pier". Any watering hole suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[dillen]

Rock Bottom Brewery At the corner of Grand and Clark Is with in walking distance of Navy Pier Have A Good Time Say Hello To Pete Crowley the brew master.

[Payson]

Thanks. I'll definitely check it out. Do they have any cask ales? Also, Chicago allows all ABV %'s don't they?

[studentofbeer]

yes chicago allows all abv's. dont think rock bottom will have any cask tho.

best place to go for that would be perhaps the map room or goose island (always has one of their brews on cask). also another good stop is hop leaf if you like belgian beer. unfortunately all of these are a decent hike from downtown, with goose island probably being the easiest with an el ride of only 3 stops or so. id highly recommend going their for a tasting.

also recommended in my opinion is sheffields, duke of perth, clark street ale house (usually has either a bells or 3 floyds on cask)... and that's all i can think of right now.

clark street ale house isnt too far from where it sounds like you are staying-- its on clark and chicago, a pretty quick taxi or a rather long walk. they play music too loud sometimes but have a good variety of beers and cody the bartender is nice.

let me know if you need locations for any of these other places. sheffields is also accessable by train and isnt that far from downtown. it gets a bit too much of a collegey-frat crowd sometimes but has good beer. map room is a bit more out of the way and probably requires a bus ride but is one of the city's top bars. hop leaf is in andersonville and is a longer train ride and a bit of a walk, but well worth it.

i highly recommend hitting up goose tho, and maybe hop leaf if youre in the mood.

[steveh]

You're coming to Chi from South Carolina - in winter? I hope you like rude awakenings -- but at least you can find good beer!

www.rockbottom.com has a great link to their downtown Chicago pub, complete with maps. A good hike west from Rock Bottom is the Irish Pub, Fado - albeit a chain, they've done up the Chicago pub quite well, and pour a decent Guinness.
http://www.fadoirishpub.com/chicago.html

Piece Pizzeria and Brewpub is at 1927 W. North Avenue and has some great brews. They also keep a cask ale on tap.

I agree with all of Student's picks as well, especially The Map Room: http://www.maproom.com/

S.

[Prankasaur]

Hey Payson:

If you come to Chicago I highly recommend the Map Room, as sudent of beer has told you. It is not within walking distance of Navy Pier, however there is nothing within "walking distance" in Chicago in the winter time. You should spend the $6.00 cab ride and go to the Map Room. I recommend going in the afternoon so you can grab a seat. I think they have a website; they don't have a kitchen, but I think every Tuesday night they have some sort of buffet. Each week they serve food from a featured country. I think the cost is two beers, which you are going to have anyway. They have Delerium Tremens there and the like, but also a lot of American Microbrews. Map Room is at 1949 N Hoyne Street in Chicago.

Also, a brewer who has a brewpub that has gotten a lot of attention lately is Piece, a place on North Avenue which is still a cab ride from the Pier, but a lot closer. I have never been there but anybody I talk to says the beer is awesome and the pizza is great.

Also: Goose Island on Clybourne is a good place for microbrew beers; there also is a Goose Island in Wrigleyville. The Wrigleyville brewpub is astetically nice, but I prefer the one on Clybourne. In my opinion, go on Friday afternoon. The bartender is more likely to talk to you and maybe even slip you one or two free beers if you identifty yourself as a beer guru.

One more place which is certainly more touristy than beer worthy is the Signature Room on the 95th floor of the Hancock Building. The Hancock is much cooler than the Sears Tower in my opinion; the Hancock is right on Michigan Avenue where there is always plenty of sight seeing, whereas the Sears Tower is more in the business district. I would go at lunchtime (dinner time is suit and tie and 35.00 meals). You can go to the Hancock Observation room for something like $14.00 on the 96th floor, or as I like, go to the Signature Room for their buffet for $14.00. You get the same view, only you get some pretty awesome food for the same price. After lunch, go to the other side in the bar area and have a Bass Ale and enjoy the view. If you go to the Hancock, they have plenty of workers to direct you in the right way. Just tell them you want to go to the Signature Room for lunch; they will direct you to an elevator that specifically takes you there. Remember, get there at 11:15 for lunch; it starts to fill up after that.

Alright, my hands are getting tired of typing.

[Payson]

Thanks everyone for all of the great suggestions. My mouth is watering in anticipation! It's so sad to live in a state that regulates ABV and consequently excludes some of the finest beers in the land. What would you recommend as far as flying back with beer goes? Carry on?

[threecb]

When I was in Chicago last June Rock Bottom had a Stout on Cask, so they do have cask ale there.

Maybe it was just the beautiful afternoon vibe, but I liked Piece a lot. It's less than 2 blocks off from an el stop (though it is a bit of a ride on the train -- Damen stop off the blue maybe?). The beers were great, the pizza tasty, and the jazz trio was playing funky music. The Map Room isn't too far from here, either, I think -- can a local confirm?

We also made it to GI - Clyborne. Great beers, average pub food, in my (and my wife's) opinion. Good bar area though.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Payson
What would you recommend as far as flying back with beer goes? Carry on?

Eek. In this day and age, and O'Hare (assuming that's where you're flying out of) having stepped up their security, carry on bottles of liquid might not be the best idea - and I'd never check my bag with beer in it...at least not any more.

You might think about taking your purchases to the P.O. or UPS Store, though UPS might refuse to ship to South Carolina based on laws.

You might just have to drink enough to keep the memories alive until your next visit.

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by threecb
Maybe it was just the beautiful afternoon vibe, but I liked Piece a lot. It's less than 2 blocks off from an el stop (though it is a bit of a ride on the train -- Damen stop off the blue maybe?). The beers were great, the pizza tasty, and the jazz trio was playing funky music. The Map Room isn't too far from here, either, I think -- can a local confirm?

Yes, Piece is about a block east down North Ave from the Damen Blue Line stop - was just there yesterday. Though I was mistaken in an earlier post, they don't have cask conditioned ale on tap. They do have great beer, though. I sampled a very nice Kolsch and a tasty English Bitter - that bordered on a Brown Ale with its use of roasted malts. They also had guest beers of 3 Floyd's Robt. The Bruce, Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, and a Summit brew.

The Map Room is certainly in the vicinity (and they do have cask ale), but it would be a bit of a hike from Piece - 'bout nine blocks north on Damen and a block west on Armitage. It doesn't help out-of-towners that Damen, North, and Milwaukee all come together as a six corner intersection right there near Piece. But there should be plenty of cabs in the neighborhood.

You could plan a circuit of the train or a cab to Piece, a cab to the Map Room, then a Cab to Goose Island Lincoln Park - that ought to be enough beer for one afternoon!

S.

[studentofbeer]

grrr my whole post was sucked off into the ether when my browser mysteriously closed.

anyway, i was going to say that coming back to chicago from LA (LAX security is even more annoying than o'hare i think) i've packed maybe 5 bombers and 3-4 12oz. bottles in checked luggage and had it get through safely, even after being lost for a day and searched by TSA (maybe i got really lucky?)

also ive taken 3-4 12oz. bottles carry-on without trouble.

and on a layover in austin i saw a guy carry on an entire case of fat tire (i was *this* close to asking if i could buy some off of him-- never tried it), seemingly without any trouble.

so i think if you are willing to take a small risk it might be ok.

[Kalleh1]

Even though I have lived in the Chicago area for a long time, it wasn't until I met Steve on this board that I have found some wonderful beer drinking. Today, my husband and I joined Steve and BluesHarp, and someone else (??), all of whom post here, and I had some wonderful cask conditioned beer at the Firkin and Mickey Finn's in Libertyville. I almost felt like I was in London!

I cannot wait to host Richard English here and to show him that, yes, we do have real beer in Chicago!

[Caffinehog]

Three Floyds Brewery is a bit further, right over the border in Munster, IN. If you do any traveling around in the Chicago area, this is something to check out.

[steveh]

The cask ale we enjoyed at Libertyville's The Firkin was 3 Floyd's Robert the Bruce. It was interesting in that it tasted different than the last cask of the same beer the establishment had on draught. It was more mellow in its hops and (IMO) slightly thinner in body and lighter in roasted malts. The joy of cask ale - if there's any left by next week-end, I'll try it then to see how it may have changed.

S.

[BluesHarp]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
Even though I have lived in the Chicago area for a long time, it wasn't until I met Steve on this board that I have found some wonderful beer drinking. Today, my husband and I joined Steve and BluesHarp, and someone else (??), all of whom post here, and I had some wonderful cask conditioned beer at the Firkin and Mickey Finn's in Libertyville. I almost felt like I was in London!

I cannot wait to host Richard English here and to show him that, yes, we do have real beer in Chicago!

Kalleh...the other member of our party was my cousin, bluesnbrews, a relatively new member on this forum, but certainly NOT new to good beer!

We had a great time; Kalleh, her husband, and Steve are all very nice people...it was truly a pleasure to get to know them in person.

While at The Firkin, we began talking to a couple of ladies drinking shots of lemondrop (?); a short while later, I had one of them drinking Great Lakes Burning River Pale Ale and shortly after that introduced her to Three Floyds Alpha King. She was under the misconception that she didn't like "dark" beers, but the Burning River made a perfect segue; she loved the Alpha King!...another successful conversion to the world of fine beers.

Speaking of successful...when bluesnbrews and I ajourned for dinner, Steve seemed to having a pretty good time with the two attractive ladies...hmmmm......;)

Thanks again to Steve for the tour of Libertyville, IL's finest pubs.

[steveh]

Originally posted by BluesHarp
Kalleh...the other member of our party was my cousin, bluesnbrews, a relatively new member on this forum, but certainly NOT new to good beer!

We had a great time; Kalleh, her husband, and Steve are all very nice people...it was truly a pleasure to get to know them in person.

As it was the two of you! Next time, I promise I'll meet your wives - it got awfully busy around us, didn't it?

While at The Firkin, we began talking to a couple of ladies drinking shots of lemondrop (?); a short while later, I had one of them drinking Great Lakes Burning River Pale Ale and shortly after that introduced her to Three Floyds Alpha King. She was under the misconception that she didn't like "dark" beers, but the Burning River made a perfect segue; she loved the Alpha King!...another successful conversion to the world of fine beers.

Teri says she's a beer drinker at heart, she just needs that nudge toward the good stuff - and I think she got it!

Speaking of successful...when bluesnbrews and I ajourned for dinner, Steve seemed to having a pretty good time with the two attractive ladies...hmmmm......

I'm considering you and BB my new good luck talismans! ;)

Thanks again to Steve for the tour of Libertyville, IL's finest pubs.

My complete pleasure, look out Delafield - you're next!

S.

[Kalleh1]

Well, I have been a bit of a pest trying to set Steve up with someone, so I am quite pleased to hear this! Steve not only knows a lot about beer, but he is also a great guy!

I thought about the 2 wives shopping while their husbands drank beer and thought, now which would I do...shop...or drink good cask conditioned beer. Hmmm, it would be a hard decision, but I think I'd take the beer!;)

As for the beers, hands down I preferred The Firkin's Robert the Bruce to the American Pale Ale and the Traditonal Irish Stout, all of which were cask conditioned. To me, the 3 Floyds' Robert the Bruce comes in a close second to Fuller's 1845, my favorite beer. Does anyone know how that name "Robert the Bruce" was derived? It seems strange to me.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
Does anyone know how that name "Robert the Bruce" was derived? It seems strange to me.

Back to the history books Kalleh, or at least the movie "Braveheart." Robert the Bruce was one of the first kings of Scotland and a champion of their independence from England. http://www.britannia.com/bios/robertbruce.html

Of note, 3 Floyds also has an Irish red ale called "Brian Boru."

S.

PS - Thanks for the kind words!

[BluesHarp]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
Well, I have been a bit of a pest trying to set Steve up with someone, so I am quite pleased to hear this! Steve not only knows a lot about beer, but he is also a great guy!

I thought about the 2 wives shopping while their husbands drank beer and thought, now which would I do...shop...or drink good cask conditioned beer. Hmmm, it would be a hard decision, but I think I'd take the beer!



...at the risk of embarrassing Steve (or giving him a big head;) ), I would have to agree with Kalleh's assessment. There is always a bit of uncertainty in meeting up with someone you know only from an internet bulletin board, but Steve certainly seems like a stand-up guy.

Luckily our wives were more than happy to drop us at the pub and shop. They were a bit nervous about what shape we would be in several hours later, but we stuck mostly to half-pints as to be able to get the most tasting in without getting too stupid.

My cousin bluesnbrews was a little nervous about his wife walking in while we were engaged in conversation with a couple of attractive ladies (he's only been married a couple years).
I've been married so long my wife is used to my flirtatious nature and is WAY past being bothered by it.

Since we left Steve with both women...everybody won!!

[Kalleh1]

There is always a bit of uncertainty in meeting up with someone you know only from an internet bulletin board I agree, BluesHarp. Yet, I have met a few people from posting on boards now, and it has always been a pleasure. In fact, Richard English and I post on a board about words and language (I am happy to send anyone a link to that board if you send me a PM), and it was he who suggested this board to me. I have met Richard, and he also is just great...he is humorous, very interesting and intelligent (boy, does he know his beer!), and he is very personable. He is in no way what I would call your typical Brit, which to me means standoffish, cool, and maybe a little arrogant. If you travel to England, I would highly recommend meeting up with Richard at a pub or two.

In fact, my husband and I will be in England in a week, and we plan to tour the Young's Brewery with Richard.

[chazwicke]

I agree with Kalleh's assessment of Richard. I enjoyed sampling beers with him at GBBF last summer.

[chazwicke]

Also, I'll be back across the pond in May and hope to hoist a few with him then.

[Richard English]

Oh good heavens! I'll need to set up a fan club soon!:eek:

And I'm to be in Chicago at the end of April plus Orlando around Thanksgiving - so there's even more opportunity for people to buy me beer!

[Payson]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
In fact, Richard English and I post on a board about words and language [/B]

Do you two "conversate" about the sad state of affairs our language is in?

Sorry, I couldn't resist throwing in that evil word that is so pervasive all of a sudden!

[steveh]

Originally posted by Payson
Do you two "conversate" about the sad state of affairs our language is in?

Like? ;)

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by BluesHarp
...at the risk of embarrassing Steve (or giving him a big head)

Okay - enough of this silliness! To quote a great marketing tagline (albeit from a mediocre beer, and I still say they stole it from me), It's all about the beer!

We're all on the same great team that attracts great folk (except those weird Mandarin Heffe fans ;–)). Everyone I've met in person from this board is tops - Kalleh (her husband, who doesn't even like beer that much), Blues n' Blues, and the benevolent Mr. Prankasaur. And we can't discount our trader friends, even if they are outside the midwest!! ;–)

S.

Oh, and Richard - you have big shoes to fill when I get to meet you next month! ;)

[Richard English]

Quote "...Do you two "conversate" about the sad state of affairs our language is in..."

I had never heard this rather ugly and quite unnecessary word, I have to say.

"Conversate" is obviously a back-formation that creates a verb from the noun "conversation". Since "conversation is itself a noun formed fro the original verb "converse" , "conversate" clearly has no reason to exist.

Let us hope that its existence is as brief and fleeting as the flavour of Bud Lite!

[Richard English]

Quote "...Oh, and Richard - you have big shoes to fill when I get to meet you next month! ..."

Never mind about the size of my shoes; it's the size of the glass that matters! None of these emaciated 330 cl jobs, if you don't mind.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
Never mind about the size of my shoes; it's the size of the glass that matters! None of these emaciated 330 cl jobs, if you don't mind.

Plenty of imperial pints to go 'round! ;)

S.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
Let us hope that its existence is as brief and fleeting as the flavour of Bud Lite!

Careful, that's close to conceding that Bud Lite actually has flavor (which we all no it doesn't)!

S.

[Kalleh1]

I am getting a kick out of reading this thread on this mostly-men board about beer. Warm and fuzzy posts? Who'd have thunk it? ;)

And, to appease Steve and keep it about beer, did any of you see the Wall Street Journal article that says Anheuser Busch is not longer the world's number 1 brewery? Will wonders ever cease?

[Beaver]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
I am getting a kick out of reading this thread on this mostly-men board about beer. Warm and fuzzy posts? Who'd have thunk it? ;)

And, to appease Steve and keep it about beer, did any of you see the Wall Street Journal article that says Anheuser Busch is not longer the world's number 1 brewery? Will wonders ever cease?

So who will be the new number one?

[Stodbrew]

Originally posted by Beaver
So who will be the new number one?


I believe Interbrew, based out of Belgium, bought AmBev, based out of Brazil.

[Kalleh1]

In the Journal they said that now Anheuser is no longer no. 1 in the world beer market by volume. The pending combination of Belgium's Interbrew SA and Brazil's Cia. de Bebidas das Americas SA or AmBev is poised to overtake the.

Now, I am only reporting what was written in the Wall Street Journal, and I have no independent knowledge of this.

[Beaver]

Thanks for the info Kalleh and Stodbrew. I think I remember reading about that now.

[Kalleh1]

We have been hosting Richard here in Chicago, and, of course, he is interested in "good beer." Here is the problem: While Chicago probably has the best beer in the U.S. (my own biased opinion!), because it is in the beginning stages, oftentimes they run out of their cask-conditioned beer. How annoying!

Can you believe that on Thursday, Goose Island's BrewPub ran out of it? We had one measley pint between the 4 of us! Then, on Friday, the Firkin (in Libertyville) had run out of it, though across the street Mickey Finn had 2 beers on cask. And, the Firkin did have a wonderful selection of beer on tap, without it being too cold or too carbonated (Richard's 2 complaints about our beers.)

On Saturday, then, we were told that the Rock Bottom had cask conditioned beer. No such luck; they were all out. They recommended a wonderful little pub, the Clark Street Ale House. They had one cask conditioned beer, which had just been tapped last night. Sadly, it wasn't quite ready, according to Richard. So, off to Mac's American Bar and Grill on Division. Now, we had Richard in Heaven. This little neighborhood bar had 2 wonderful beers on cask. Finally, we had impressed him! He is now home with us, drinking Fuller's 1845. Tomorrow we will tour Goose Island's BrewPub, and I trust they will have cask conditioned beer again.

All in all, I think Richard has been positively impressed with Chicago's beer. Why? He actually said that he could move here if needed because we, in fact, do have good beer. Now, that is a compliment! :)

[Beaver]

Sounds like a lot of fun, Kalleh1!

[chazwicke]

I knew he was going to be in good hands with you. Washington DC / Baltimore area has many breweries and good beer bars. I think we could easily rival Chi town. I look forward to meeting up with Richard when I am across the pond. (I leave Friday for 8 days). Glad you all are having a good visit.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
We have been hosting Richard here in Chicago, and, of course, he is interested in "good beer." Here is the problem: While Chicago probably has the best beer in the U.S. (my own biased opinion!), because it is in the beginning stages, oftentimes they run out of their cask-conditioned beer. How annoying!


Just goes to show - we have good beer, and we're consuming it faster than it can be brewed!

T'was quite the weekend for RealBeer.comers - I got to meet the inimitable Richard and enjoy closing the Firkin in Libertyville with he and Kalleh.

Then, Kalleh and her husband, Richard and I - with a surprise, last minute appearance by new friend StudentOfBeer - toured the Goose Island brew-pub on Clybourn yesterday and made new friends, including head brewer of their micro facility, John J. Hall. We've invited John to visit us here on the board - with some coaxing, we'll have some great insight on another brewery.

Thanks for visiting Richard, thanks for hosting Kalleh, thanks for joining us Student. The RealBeer.com community continues to leave its mark around the world!

S.

Oh, and Chaz - Richard will be expecting to hear from you next week!

[studentofbeer]

it was a great time, and i was very happy to meet all of you. thanks for the fun!

[Kalleh1]

And, of course the men don't mention the four 20-something women (beautiful!) whom Richard met and had quite a time with. He coaxed them into trying cask-conditioned beer, and I believe he convinced them. In fact, I had to drag Richard away from them (women love that English accent!) so that we wouldn't miss our plane.

Just a thought: Having had a wonderful time tasting good beer here in Chicago, I have realized something for the single ladies on the board. The men whom I have met who are true connoisseurs of beer (not just beer drinkers) are some of the best men I have ever met. Wine connoisseurs are often yuppie, arrogant types. That is not the case at all for beer connoisseurs. The ones I have met have been intelligent, friendly, and very patient with those of us who are learning about beer.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Kalleh1
And, of course the men don't mention the four 20-something women (beautiful!) whom Richard met and had quite a time with.

You may want to word that differently...

Kalleh should also mention that none of us walked away with a phone number, but I will now affect a British accent when walking into a pub!

The ones I have met have been intelligent, friendly, and very patient with those of us who are learning about beer.

Then there's me... ;)

S.

[Richard English]

Quote "...I look forward to meeting up with Richard when I am across the pond. (I leave Friday for 8 days). Glad you all are having a good visit...."

I will be in London on the 10th (but not in the evening) the 11th (but in the Garland at Redhill in the evening - that's 30 minutes on the train from Victoria); the 12th and in the Victoria (Fuller's) in the evening and the 13th with no plans for the evening.

[Richard English]

Quote "...Kalleh should also mention that none of us walked away with a phone number..."

This is true - but then nobody asked. I'd have found out numbers if that's what was needed. After all, with my aged features and residence in distant parts none of those young would have considered that a risk!

[BluesHarp]

Originally posted by Kalleh1

The men whom I have met who are true connoisseurs of beer (not just beer drinkers) are some of the best men I have ever met. Wine connoisseurs are often yuppie, arrogant types. That is not the case at all for beer connoisseurs. The ones I have met have been intelligent, friendly, and very patient with those of us who are learning about beer.

Oh, please stop...you're embarrassing me! :D

I'm sorry I couldn't make it last weekend; I had a blast last time I visited "South of the Border"

[BluesHarp]

Originally posted by steveh

Kalleh should also mention that none of us walked away with a phone number,



heh, heh, heh....;)

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
After all, with my aged features and residence in distant parts none of those young would have considered that a risk!

Although, they may have considered it an adventure Richard - sweep them away to a foreign land! ;)

S.

Aged features, right - I should look so good. Maybe I ought to start drinking more cask ales...Richard may have discovered the secret!

[steveh]

Originally posted by BluesHarp
heh, heh, heh....

Richard's right - no one asked...then again, I'm used to girls asking me for my number! ;)

S.

[chazwicke]

Originally posted by Richard English
Quote "...I look forward to meeting up with Richard when I am across the pond. (I leave Friday for 8 days). Glad you all are having a good visit...."

I will be in London on the 10th (but not in the evening) the 11th (but in the Garland at Redhill in the evening - that's 30 minutes on the train from Victoria); the 12th and in the Victoria (Fuller's) in the evening and the 13th with no plans for the evening.

I have plans for Monday evening the 10th and Tuesday evening the 11th. Other then that I think I'm free.

[chazwicke]

Perhaps if Stronk is around he could meet up with us too.

[Richard English]

Shall we say provisionally the Victoria in the evening of the 12th? It's a meeting of my Public Speaking Club but nobody has to speak if they don't want to and there are usually some good speeches.

We meet in the Library bar (upstairs) from 1900 but I usually get the earlier.

I can be contacted on my mobile - 07885 429799

[steveh]

Richard - did those 2 bottles survive the flight?

S.

[Richard English]

Thank you, Steve. They did (I put them in my hand baggage just to be sure!)

I haven't yet sampled them as I've been REALLY busy since I got back.

Thank you for letting me have them.

By the way, all the pictures came out - including the one of the young ladies at Goose Island. Sadly the one who didn't like good beer because she'd never tried it - and who finally sampled that US Witbeer and couldn't keep the beam of delight from her face - she was just out of shot.

There are also some good ones of you and studentofbeer that I'll be happy to email over if you tell me the best address.

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
Thank you for letting me have them.

My complete pleasure, I hope you enjoy them!

By the way, all the pictures came out - including the one of the young ladies at Goose Island. Sadly the one who didn't like good beer because she'd never tried it - and who finally sampled that US Witbeer and couldn't keep the beam of delight from her face - she was just out of shot.

A shame, she was the cutest! Not that they weren't all lovely, that is. ;)

There are also some good ones of you and studentofbeer that I'll be happy to email over if you tell me the best address.

I'll send an e-mail address to you via Private Message - I haven't downloaded the pictures of the brewery tour yet. Admin Stan is promising to make a photo gallery available to us here soon.

S.

[chazwicke]

Originally posted by Richard English
Shall we say provisionally the Victoria in the evening of the 12th? It's a meeting of my Public Speaking Club but nobody has to speak if they don't want to and there are usually some good speeches.

We meet in the Library bar (upstairs) from 1900 but I usually get the earlier.

I can be contacted on my mobile - 07885 429799

That would be fine. Do you have the address of the Victoria?

[Richard English]

Hello Chaswyke,

The Victoria is at Lancaster Gate and the nearest tube is either Lancaster Gate (Central Line) or Paddington (District and Circle). Either is about seven minutes walk.

When you arrive I shall either be in the downstairs bar (there's only the one) or upstairs in the Library. After 1900 I'll definitely be in the library but I should arrive at the pub by 1800 as I shall already be in London doing a group facilitation.

To get to the library bar, leave the main bar at either side of the serving area and go up the spiral staircase. Turn right at the top (there's a bar on the left - the theatre bar - but I won't be there. Walk to the end of the passage and just come in. If anyone tells you it's a private meeting, just tell them you've come to meet me.

The full address of the Victoria is Strathearn Place, London, W2 2NH and the telephone number is 020 7724 1191. You can see its location here:

http://uke.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&db=pc&addr1=&client=public&addr2=&advanced=&addr3=&pc=W22NH&quicksearch=W22nh&cidr_client=none

[chazwicke]

Excellent! I shall see you there. Thanks!

[Kalleh1]

Chazwicke, I know you've been to London before, though I don't know if you've been to the Victoria. It was my absolute favorite. The upstairs library is exactly how I had pictured English pubs. I have a friend here who is from Manchester, and he has always told me that we in America romanticize the British pubs and that they are really no different from ours. That is not the case, at least in reference to Chicago. Our bars (the ones I have been to...and maybe Steve will correct me) are loud and don't have the atmosphere that I experienced in London. However, one of the romanticisms, I believe, is that the Brits are very social in the pubs. I didn't find the people any friendlier in the British pubs, and, in fact, I think they may be friendlier here.

[chazwicke]

I am much looking forward to my trip. And to the Victoria. I have not been to that particular pub before. I have several favorites in London one of which Richard recommended on a prior trip. In fact, I am meeting with my son, my ex-wife and her husband who will also be in London on Tuesday evening and I am taking them on a little pub crawl including the Buckingham Arms and others nearby it. I love the pubs there almost as much as the cask ale. I find them quite different from most of our bars which tend to cater to the yuppies, sports fans or have a stage with bands playing. I like a quiet place where you talk and actually hear the other person with whom you are speaking to. Maybe I'm showing my age. I also intend to visit the Wenlock Arms on this trip based on the recommendations of others on this board. I have been to many pubs and breweries in England, Scotland and Wales and I love them.

[Richard English]

Quote "...However, one of the romanticisms, I believe, is that the Brits are very social in the pubs. I didn't find the people any friendlier in the British pubs, and, in fact, I think they may be friendlier here..."

This is a comparitive thing. In England people are nowhere near so ready to speak to strangers as are Americans. In a pub the reticence is less but people are still not a chatty as is the average American.

Your Mancunian friend has either forgotten what English pubs are like (many in Manchester being very good) or else didn't spend too much time in his Manchester locals. The Marble Arch (on the Rochdale Road) is a superb pub and quite unlike anything I have ever seen in the USA. The closest to a tradional English town boozer I saw in Chicago was the pub (Clarke Street, was it?) where the beer was not ready.

One huge difference is that very few pubs will have a host or hostess to show you to your table and a waiter to take serve you. That doesn't happen in an English pub. Now, whether that's a good thing or a bad thing I am not discussing - but if you have that kind of setup in England you have a restaurant , not a pub.

[chazwicke]

I found a little info on the Victoria at this site:

http://www.pubs.com/victw2.htm

[Richard English]

Interesting that they don't mention the upstairs bars - maybe they didn't find them! The library bar is behind the window furthest to the left, behind the sign.

[Kalleh1]

I agree with both of you that we don't have anything that compares to British pubs. Richard, that pub you remembered was the Clark Street Ale House, and that was the first time I was there. However, if you recall, it had just opened when we were there (we were knocking at the door! :)), and I suspect that it would soon become loud & smokey, like most bars in the U.S.

Steve is more reliable, though, in evaluating our pubs. Perhaps I have missed some good ones along the way.

BTW, Chazwicke, the only time I have ever seen Fuller's 1845 on a menu in the U.S. was when I was in Alexandria, VA, at a restaurant. I think the east coast is at least as good as Chicago, if not better, re: good beer.

[chazwicke]

Alexandria currently has two breweries. There are some decent restraunts there too. I just wish we had the options that Richard has. :D

[Richard English]

Quote "...carry on bottles of liquid might not be the best idea ...

When I flew back to the UK from O'Hare I carried two bottles that Stevah had given me (thank you for those - one's gone already). I had no problems at all.

[chazwicke]

I have flown many times with beer and my only recommendation is to make sure you carry it in the cabin and not shipped in your baggage. Some of the bottle caps have leaked in the past because of the lack of pressurizing in the hold.

I want to say I had a great trip to London and managed to drink 68 beers. I attended the Ealing Broadway Beer Festival on two days and visited many pubs as well. Some old favorites and some new ones including the famed Wenlock Arms. I met several new friends at the Ealing fest and have even been asked to work at the GBBF if I attend this summer, which I hope to do. I also enjoyed being Richard's guest one evening at The Victoria Pub and attending a meeting of an organization to which he belongs called The Simpletons. I had an excellent and interesting time with them. Thank you again Richard, and it was very nice to see you again. I hope to see you at the GBBF. Please visit Washington DC area And I can return the favor by showing you some of the best of the Mid Atlantic region.

As usual I found the cask ales to be wonderful and I tried to keep a list. The only marginal beers I had were on my first night while attending a private party for Eric Clapton's band at the Hard Rock Cafe. They were four John Smiths on nitro tap. ( I attended Clapton's Monday night show at Royal Albert Hall.) Here is a listing of the beers that I drank and where I drank them. I hope it copys ok below:

John Smith's nitro-draught private party Hard Rock Café
John Smith's nitro-draught private party Hard Rock Café
John Smith's nitro-draught private party Hard Rock Café
John Smith's nitro-draught private party Hard Rock Café
Fullers London Pride North Star Ealing Broadway
Fullers ESB Town Hall Ealing Broadway
Spitfire
Fullers London Pride Princess of Wales
Batemans DM (Dark Mild) Weatherspoons Tower Hill
Ridleys Old Bob Weatherspoons Tower Hill
Adnams Regatta Bridgehouse Tower Bridge
Harveys Sussex Bitter
Ichen Valley Pure Gold Shipwright Arms
Adnams Bitter Westminster Arms
J W Lees Maypole Madness Weatherspoons Trafalgar Square
Charles Wells Bombardier Tom Cribb
Fullers London Pride
Theakston Black Bull Bitter Museum
Shepherd Neame Early Bird
Deuchers IPA Bag O Nails
Batemans DM (Dark Mild) Weatherspoons Victoria
Marstons Pedigree bottle
Youngs St. Georges Marquis De Anglesey
St. Austell Tribute Covent Garden
Deuchers IPA Roundhouse
Adnams Bitter
Frolic Bitter
Fullers London Pride Victoria
Fullers London Pride Victoria
Fullers London Pride Victoria
Fullers London Pride Victoria
Fullers London Pride Victoria
Greene King IPA
Timothy Taylors LandLord Baker Street
Marstons Old Empire Baker Street
Brakspars Bitter St. Johns Wood
West Berkshire Maggs Head Wenlock Arms
Mighty Oak Maldon Gold 1/2 pt Wenlock Arms
Pitfield EKG 1/2 pt Wenlock Arms
Old Swan Original 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Maldons Moletrap 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Harviestoun Dragonfly 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Caingorm Tradewinds 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Dark Star Mild 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Fullers Pride Export (rare cask) 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Osset Pale Gold 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Harveys Knots of May Light Mild 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Ringwood Boondoggle 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Chiltern Beechwood Bitter 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Harviestoun Bitter & Twisted 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Vale Best Bitter 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Fullers Chizwicke Bitter Blackbird Earls Court
Marstons Pedigree bottle
Deuchers IPA 1/2 pt Bag O Nails
Shepherd Neame Best bitter 1/2 pt Cask & Glass
Youngs Bitter Buckingham Arms
Titanic Whitestar Albert
Woodefords Great Eastern 1/2 pt Weatherspoons Trafalgar Square
Hydes Cloud Nine 1/2 pt Weatherspoons Trafalgar Square
Adnans Bitter 1/2 pt
Vale Black Swan Dark Mild 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Rebellion IPA 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Cannon Kings Shilling 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Castle Rock Harvest Pale 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Boat Man in the Boat 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Vale Grumpling Premium 1/2 pt Ealing Broadway Festival
Fullers ESB Blackbird Earls Court
Fursty Ferret bottle

[Richard English]

I'm glad you enjoyed yourself, Chaswyke and yes, I intend to be at the GBBF this year.

I should maybe have posted a general warning about John Smith's. A poor beer at the best of times and on nitro-keg even poorer. It sells in the USA since it is, compared with the likes of A-B, wonderful. However, as the American palate becomes accustomed to the far better beers now available, both imported and, increasingly, domestic, I suspect that John Smith's, along with Tetley's will be shunned by the discerning American drinker as it is shunned by the discerning British drinker.

All the other beers you tried are known to be of high quality and you were lucky to be able to sample Itchen Valley, since it is not usually available too far from its home in Hampshire.

I'm impressed, too, that you managed to track down the Tom Cribb - since most visitors to Leicester Square never venture down Panton Street. I don't suppose the Cribb has changed much in 200 years!

I'm not scheduled to visit Washington DC as yet although I'll be in Florida in November. It depends on work, really. If I get a sppeaking or facilitation job on the East Coast then I'll see what I can do!

[chazwicke]

The Tom Cribb was nice. I walked there from Trafalgar Square actually. The Ichen Valley was a fine beer and I enjoyed that pub as well. The Shipwright Arms. I believe it too is an historic pub. I had a friend traveling with me whom I was showing some of the obligatory, major sites in London as he had not seen them previously. My stratagy was to visit a pub or two between each stop and we did walk much every day. He traveled for the Eric Clapton functions and that is why I was at the Hard Rock Cafe, an awful place. It was a choice between the John Smiths or Stella I believe. Drinks were provided. I was saddened that my trip was not kicked off with a proper pint of cask but we literally disembarked the plane and headed for that private function. I told him that the Clapton show put me behind in my drinking schedule. LOL. The John Smiths are better then any AB product but not by much. I also particularly enjoyed Deuchers IPA, Harviestoun Dragonfly, Bitter and Twisted, Caingorm Tradewinds, Fuller's Export and of course Tim TaylorsLandlord. Too bad I sampled some of them only once this time. The most disappointing beer (Besides the John Smiths) was the Woodefords Great Eastern. I usually like the Woodefords beers especially the Wherry. I was again impressed with the Weatherspoons chain. They have a better selection and great pricing. They are usually a safe bet. My only regret is that I did have to pass up several old favorites and even some that I had not tasted before. I felt guilty holding him up while I sampled pints. (He did not usually drink beer during the day). I will eithe come alone to the GBBF (My wife does not drink either) or with a friend who appreciates decent beer. I do have one question that maybe you can help with Richard. Who makes Frolic Bitter? I had it at a pub and the young barkeep did not know the answer when I asked.

[Theakston]

Bloody hell downtown chicago seems to have improved!

[chazwicke]

I can say that my son enjoyed Manchester, Theakston. He was in the UK at the same time as I was and we did meet up in London for dinner one night. He is 17 and was traveling with his mother and step father whose family is from England. They were in Manchester for a family wedding and someone gave my son two pints and he was suitably impressed. Although I think it was with being actually served alcohol rather than the beer. I met up with them at Bag O' Nails and had intended on taking them on a small pub crawl or at least to the Buckingham Arms but they had not eaten so, alas we had dinner rather than pints. Another missed opportunity in my drinking schedule! ( I do allow my son to quaff an occasional beer at home and he has at leased sampled many fine beers. Gotta raise them right!)

[Richard English]

Ah Manchester!

Hydes, Holts and Lees. And the Marble Arch in the Rochdale Road. Happy days!

[Kalleh1]

Oh, Chazwicke, it sounds as though you had fun in London! I may be coming to DC in June and, if so, would love some recommendations of good pubs. I should know soon.

[Richard English]

Quote "...Who makes Frolic Bitter? I had it at a pub and the young barkeep did not know the answer when I asked...."

This is a seasonal brew from Gales of Horndean. You were lucky to get it as they only brew it around Easter time.

In the USA Gales distribute their incomparable Prize Old Ale which is still supplied in a bottle sealed with a cylindrical cork - the only beer in the UK still made this way so far as I know.

Kalleh had kept a bottle for me as a surprise when I visited Chicago although, sadly, it had to split three ways!

[chazwicke]

AHA! Gales! I have several bottles of the Prize Old Ale in my cellar. Thanks Richard!!

Kalleh, I would be happy to give some recommendations and perhaps you, Theakston, Meridian, and I could meet up. And of course anyone else in our area would be welcome too. There is a festival going on in late June if you are here during that time which will have Real Ale.

Old Dominion Beer Festival
Friday June 25-Sunday June 27
Old Dominion Brewing Co.
Ashburn, VA
The annual Old Dominion Beer Festival is one of the best beer festivals in
the country. The Global Brewers Guild will be on-hand presenting beers from
Abita Beer, Allagash Brewing, Baltimore Brewing Co.(DeGroen's), Flying Dog
Ales, Rogue Ales, and Belukus Marketing(Belhaven, Chimay, De Koninck,
Maredsous, and Young's & Co.). Special features this year include a Real Ale
tent serving cask-conditioned ale and a Global European Beer Garden.
http://www.olddominion.com

Also, Baltimore is a wonderful brewing town and is easy to get to from DC.

I know you and I have conversed privately about CAMRA. I was encouraged by several members whom were involved with the Ealing Broadway festival that I attended to start more North American chapters.

Lastly, I feel sort of let down now after having so many wonderful cask ales at my fingertips and now very few. I've got to get back for the GBBF. Anyone else going?

[Kalleh1]

Kalleh had kept a bottle for me as a surprise when I visited Chicago although, sadly, it had to be split three ways!
Yes, and they were small bottles, too. Oh, and it was soooo good!

The dates that I'd be in DC would be the 15th and 16th of June, and I'd be staying at the Fairmont, near Georgetown. There must be something in Georgetown, right? I would love to meet up with some other people! I am just not sure yet that this meeting is actually going to take place. I should know soon.

Unfortunately, I can't make the Beer Festival in England because our annual convention is between August 3-6. That is annoying! But, I know just what you mean, Chazwycke. It is all so easy in England. While we can get cask conditioned beer here in Chicago, the places are few and far between. I haven't really followed up on that CAMRA idea. However, if it is more active here in the states, maybe we'll have more choices of beers. What probably won't change, though, are our bars. I just loved the pubs in England and wish we had similar ones here.