Feedback on my recipie

[rgailey23]

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[beerking]

Well, first off, it will be hard to make a Framboise from this recipe. Framboise is a raspberry lambic, and you are adding cherries. Cherry lambic is called "Kriek." ;)

As for the actual recipe, the first thing I notice is you are only adding Brett, but no other "beasties." Lambic has fermentation by Brett, as well as Lacto bacillius, malolactic bacteria, pediococcus, and possibly some other bacteria. In order to truly get the sour complexity of a good lambic, you need these as well. I would recommend using either White Labs WLP655 Belgian Sour Mix, or Wyeast 3278 Belgian Lambic Blend. Do not make a starter, and do not use Saccromyces (the second part is less important). Alternately, you can add White Labs WLP675 Malolactic Bacteria and WLP677 Lactobacillus Bacteria or Wyeast 5335 Lactobacillus and Wyeast 5733 Pediococcusto your mix.

Note that Wyeast says about their blend: "For accelerated results, time inoculation at the beginning of primary fermentation." You will get the best balance of funk characteristics by doing this instead of using Saccromyces. You could alternately add the wild stuff about half way through the primary ferment.

I say do not make a starter because the blend contains organisms that work well quickly with simple sugars, and organisms that work well with complex sugars over time. If you make a starter, only the simple sugar eaters will reproduce in any quantity, and you will get a different balance than intended in the pack/vial.

I am not sure about your method of "force aging" the hops, but it does not sound like a good idea. I would just use the oldest hops you have or can get, that don't smell bad, and don't use too much. Bittering only, no flavor or aroma.

Malt bill looks good. Cherries (or raspberries) in secondary is good.

If you really want it to work, put the batch in a 5-7 gal oak barrel right after cooling, and let it ferment in there. You will get slow oxygen transfer through the wood, which will aid the aerobic part of the fermentation. Let sit in the barrel 6-12 months, until flavor is where you want it. Sour and Funk will increase over time.

[markaberrant]

I wouldn't use honey, you want lots of dextrins (not simple sugars) for the yeast to slowly feed on. Add some carapils instead (honey malt or another light crystal malt would work too) and mash high.

If you follow Beerking's advice (which I second) and add something other than sacc and brett yeast (go with one of the blends), I wouldn't expect it to taste very good at 6-8 months... the acids produced need longer than that to soften and meld.

And with a lambic, there is no secondary, it's a single vessel fermentation. Dump your blend in, and wait 12-24 months.

[rgailey23]

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[corkybstewart]

I've seen aged hops for sale at morebeer.com I think.
Has your girlfriend ever tried Brett fermented beers? It may be that she hates the funky taste. There are days my wife loves my Cherry Brett beer, but a lot more days she really hates it. I she wants sweet and raspberry, maybe a wit or hefeweizen with raspberries would be a better choice.
And I don't see any need for rice hulls. I routinely do mashes with 50 or 60% wheat without rice hulls.

[rgailey23]

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[markaberrant]

If she wants a sweet cherry beer, do something like this:

3 lb 2-row pale malt
3 lb Wheat malt
2 lb honey malt or light crystal (less than 40L)
1 oz Willamette Hops @ 60 min
6 lb Cherry Puree in secondary

Yeast:
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White Labs California Ale Yeast WLP001

Mash at 155F for 60 minutes

Should be ready to drink in about 6 weeks.

[rgailey23]

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[rgailey23]

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[markaberrant]

I think it's going to be boozy, thin and dry. I also think that your questionable attempt at trying to replicate the next-to-zero hop character found in a lambic is not going to work very well in a non-lambic. I also think 3 strains of brett is complete overkill.

[rgailey23]

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[rgailey23]

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[JayShaw91]

Hey man, for real, you need to take a breather here. There are a lot of very smart people on here who really, really, know their shit. I promise you in the year I have brewing I've gained another year of brewing experience just by asking and listening to these guys.

None of their comments were meant to attack. You said you were trying to make a specific type of beer and they were trying to guide you to some ideas on how to make it better.

Also, Mark responded to you just four hours ago, so relax - he will get back to you. On top of that with your defensiveness you probably scared away the people who would otherwise be willing to help.

So here is a nickel's worth of free advice: when you come on here asking for help and opinion, don't get pissed off when you get exactly that. Oh, and BTW, everything said earlier *was* a constructive suggestion that you blew off and/or took some sort of offense to.

Now, with that vent out of the way, if you're willing to stop getting angry about what people are saying - who have nothing but the intentions to be helpful - then I'm sure people will be willing to give you other constructive suggestions.

[nelstrodomus]

...with a knife!...

[corkybstewart]

Here's my reason for asking if you ever gave her a Brett beer. When we were in Belgium bartenders kept trying to give my wife sweet fruit beers like Belle Vue Kriek-horrible, nasty syrupy cherry flavored beers. In Belgium my wife preferred true lambics and Brett beers, apparently not like most women in Belgium who order beer. Here at our house we always have a few Lindemans Kriek, Framboise, Pomme, etc, but they are for my wife's friends who have no understanding of beer. I love all Brett beers, but I really only have one beer fiend friend who like them all the time, and it really sounds like your wife is not a beer fiend. Lambics are not sweet and cannot possibly be mistaken for sweet. Brett is not sweet or sour, but it is definitely an acquired taste, and to use all 3 varieties in one beer is really pushing it.
I'm pretty active on several homebrewing forums and I will testify that the member here are by far, above and beyond the call of duty, the most helpful and the least condescending of any forum I've visited. So when I or any other member with more than 10 posts answers your question, even if you don't get the answer you want, you can bet your ass you've gotten the straight scoop(that's how we talked when I was younger, I'm sure you puppies have better slang now).
Hey, welcome to the board, I do look forward to visiting with you.