Pilsner Urquell: 1st batch color...

[BucksBrew]

Hello, I made my first batch of beer! YEAH!

Well, I made/making Pilsner Urquell. I started with 2 gallons of cool water from tap. Specialty grains were in a boiling bag in the water and the heat turned on. Instructions say to steep for 30 minutes once water temp reached 155 degrees. I did this, then no heat for 10 more minutes. Removed bag and added DME and returned to heat and so on. The total time grains were in the water was about 65 minutes.

My question is that after transferring to 2nd carboy I noticed that the color is a dark brown. I've read that it should be a gold color.

Anybody have any comments on the color?

Either way I will bottle and enjoy! Thanks.

[CaptHook]

Congrats!!! and welcome to this fun whacky pastime.
Well on to your puzzlement. You used a kit, correct? And
followed all the directions? If you then pitched into a nice CLEAN
carboy( glass) did you cover the carboy? Using your best dark tee shirt works great. If the hops are exposed too long to UV,
They will turn brown and skunky! If that is the case, that a sample
and taste it, smell it. It should not be unpleasant.Playing detective
is also part of the fun.

[BucksBrew]

Capt: Thanks. I did use a kit. My wife got it for me for Xmas and I brewed it according to the directions. Midwest-Clone Brew.

I used pellet hops that were sealed and in a sealed box. The only exposure was during initial inventory than laying out to brew. I didn't open until it was ready to use.

It is in a glass carboy fermenting (2nd). Should be ready to bottle by the 19th or so according to directions. I'm getting bubbles every 15 seconds or so. The carboy is under the sink with the door closed until I check on it, usually daily.

Thanks,
Joe

[YamahaXS]

dark brown in the carboy doesn't mean your finished beer will be dark brown.

1) the volume of beer in a carboy blocks out more light than a glass of beer, making it appear 'darker'

2) you will notice some settling, and the beer should lighten some.

3) you might of sorched the DME on the bottom of the pan. Did you stir constantly? Or did you do like I do and play a computer game while intermittantly stirring?

[BucksBrew]

I didn't stir constantly. I only stirred it occasionally. The boil wasn't all that aggressive either, just a small bubbling boil. All I read were nightmare boil overs. Maybe I did scorch it. I assumed the DME dissolved and the boil circulated it. It was brown when I poured into my primary fermenter.

I guess what your saying is, even though it's all water in there, with the DME it still can scorch.

Anyone have info on what this will do to my beer?

Thanks,
Joe

[BucksBrew]

Scorching DME: I didn't notice anything in the bottom of my pot when I emptied it. If I scortched it, wouldn't there be evidence burned to bottom of pot?

Thanks,

joe

[Richard English]

When Arthur Guinness scorched his malt in Dublin a few hundred years ago - he made a fortune from his mistake!

Maybe, just maybe...!

[BucksBrew]

I thought worst case scenario is that I have a Pilsner Urquell Dark! They don't make that, do they? haha

The problem is, how do I do the next batch to match? trial and error I guess!

Thanks for any and all responses

Joe

[YamahaXS]

Richard, can you scorch DME? I assume you can, but its not something I have set out to try to do.

My beers are always amber or darker too.

[Moboy]

Using DME or liquid as the source for most of your fermentable sugars in your beer will usually lead to a darker color in the finished product as compared to brewing all grain. I would not really worry about the colour too much, unless you are submiting the beer into a competition.

DME can scorch to the bottom of the brewpot (although not as easy as LME) if it is not stirred, which will just lead to a slight caramel taste and a darker colour.

Cheers!!!

[BucksBrew]

Thanks, I'm thinking it will be fine. I just wanted to make a beer as close to a beer that I can compare it to. I wanted to see how close I could get and so on.

While it was boiling it was brown, I'm wondering about the original ingredients. Since the company I bought it from made a few mistakes with packaging. The DME was light & Crystal looked light also, I don't know?

I'm also going to brew a faster beer just so I can try one!

Both clone kits I bought take 6-8 weeks or more. Bass & Urquell

Thanks again,

joe

[CaptHook]

Fast Beer--13th century style

Fill a bucket with crushed grain
Fill with boiling water
Cover with a sack.

Next day drain to another pail and drink fast. You have 4 days
max before it turns to--what ever!
All that simple life changed when they found hops.

Forgot the witches!! Spread a mixture of flour and salt over the
mash before covering, it keeps them away.

[BucksBrew]

FYI-I took a hydro reading this past Sunday 3-9-03 and the dark corner and the volume disguised the true color of the beer! I pulled some beer out to do a test and was surprised to see it was actually med. gold in color! I think the color will be fine.

My next hurdle is finding something other than the plastic tube the hydro came in to do readings with. Too tight and bubbles I think affected true reading of 1.22 @ 56 degrees. Onward and upward.....

[paul84043]

I failed to stir my first batch as well, plus a host of other very small errors, but I don't think I ruined my beer.
"They" say that as long as you keep things sanitary, you really have to try like mad to ruin it. You may change the taste, smell color, or what not slightly, buy you won't ruin it.

I don't think there are any beers faster than 6 weeks or so are there? I'm still DYING to try my first batch, which is impatiently aging in the basement....

[BucksBrew]

The book "The joy of Homebrewing" by Papazian (sp) says that a Brown Ale can be made and ready to drink in two weeks!

I have another Recipe Kit-Bass (clone kit). I'm undecided wether to start that or a Brown Ale. Reason being is freshness of ingredients. I got the kit for Xmas and am concerned about liquid yeast and crushed grains going bad on me.

Any input on freshness appriciated, thanks.

[CaptHook]

Fast beer 2003
Drive down to the liquor store pick up case, go home,
consume rapidly.
Fast enough?

[paul84043]

I think you would be pushing it with the yeast, I would buy another vial of it, the rest of the ingredients should be okay, have you kept the hops in the freezer? (that's what I was told to do with them)

I am interested in hearing how other's brews have come out, I keep hearing over and over from "people", mostly where I work, that home brewed beer isn't worth the effort and time, that it just doesn't taste very good....but I see people here that say they have made some great beer.

I figure that it started somewhere, and I know for a fact that the mega brew beer that I buy at the corner gas station tastes like water mixed with....well, you know what.

[BucksBrew]

Paul, What do you mean about the yeast? I tried to swirl my carboy to get the sediment to form in the center for bottling. Doing this got the foam going again on top. It was about an inch thick down to patches, now I have 1/2 inch again.

Should I pitch some more yeast? Thanks

[Richard English]

I used to brew a lot of beer at home but now brew only wine. This is because the time involved to brew beer in the kinds of quantities I'm inclined to drink can lead to storage and bottling problems.

Furthermore, although we have always had a good range of draught beers in the UK, we have, in the past ten years or so, significantly increased our production and imort of bottle-condtioned ales. Now I can , in a few minutes, buy such wonderful beers as Fuller's 1845, Coniston Bluebird; Youngs SLA, Hog's Back T.E.A plus, of course, such excellent imports as Goose Island IPA, , several Belgian beers, REAL Budweiser - from the Czech Republic, and many more. So the need to brew something drinkable has largely disappeared.

Mind you, if all I could get was A-B fizz or one of its clones, I might have a different view!

[paul84043]

Bucks, the yeast comment was aimed at the kits you have had on hand since Christmas, I don't know how hopeful I would be about those yeast vials being good still (unless it's dried, in which case, I wouldn't use it anyway) , and I don't know if I would even want to try to find out, better to pitch new yeast with the older kit.

As for your current batch, whenever you disturb the beer, you will release C02, that's where the new foam is coming from, don't worry about it, the C02 content before bottling is insignificant anyway.

No, don't pitch any more yeast, just wait for the sediment to settle out again and don't worry about the foam on top.
There's enough yeast now back in suspension since you swirled it, to carbonate with no problem.

If you're fairly confident that your SG readings have leveled out (and they pretty much should have by now!)
You're ready to bottle.

Richard, I wish we had access to those beers here in Utah, but it's all this 3.2% watered down horse swill that literally has no flavor AT ALL. If I were to go looking for a decent beer, I'm sure that it would cost an arm and a leg.

[Richard English]

Many UK brewers now export to the USA. I know for a fact that Fuller's 1845, Hog's Back T.E.A. and Young's Stout are all available.

Would you believe, by the way, that A-B Budweiser is marketed as a premium product in the UK - and costs more than our own wonderful beers!

And would you also believe that there are enough idiots living here to buy so much of it that the UK is now A-B's second-biggest market!

[BucksBrew]

Paul, There was an expiration date on the yeast. I am not past it and my wife kept it in the garage before she gave it to me. But then I guess it came in the house and sat in the pantry. That may not have helped it. I guess we will find out. Either way I'm gonna drink it, even if it kills me! haha(it won't)

[danno]

Joe, if you're worried about yeast viability, make a starter. You'll find out quickly if your yeast is any good, without wasting your whole kit, and starters will improve your fermeting by shortening your lag time (time between when you pitch your yeast and fermentation starts. That's when you're most likely to get an infection...) If you have a Wyeast smack pack, that's essentially a starter, if it swells up, most likely it will be fine...

With a day and a half to get a yeast starter going, day 2 to brew, a 4 day fermentation, rack to a keg, and force carb by the "shake like crazy" method, one could theoretically get from a kit to drinking carbonated beer in 6-7 days....

[BucksBrew]

I sent an e-mail to Michael Jackson and received a reply from Charlie Papazian!

Joe,

Michael Jackson asked that I reply to your question, since we're the experts on homebrewing. Adding crystal malt surely darkened your "pilsener." When brewing this style use the lightest malts you can find. If you use any grains at all, I'd suggest dextrine malts or aromatic malts not to exceed 1/2 pound total.
The crystal malt was probably included to lend a caramel like character to the beer, unfortunately it also adds color.

I hope this helps. And please visit us at www.beertown.org . You may wish to become a member of our American Homebrewers Association and access our electronic forums and other valuable benefits. Cheers,

Charlie Papazian

[paul84043]

DUDE...that's cool!!

It's so nice to see "famous people" that don't get so full of themselves that they can't take time to talk to us little people!!

[Richard English]

That's the thing about we British beer-drinkers - we'll talk to anyone who might buy us a pint!

[BucksBrew]

Paul, yeah, I didn't know if this was speaking with the ultimate authority or not, but it seams so, I'd think!

[BucksBrew]

Richard, So what's up? haha


When do I get my pint?

Joe

[Richard English]

I'd be happy to buy you one in my local. Shall we say the Garland? (A Harvey's House)

There's a picture of it at http://www.harveys.org.uk/t3pubs2.htm

[BucksBrew]

Looks like a fine place to me!

Let me convince the wife of our plans and I will get back to you!

Cheers!

[steveh]

Originally posted by paul84043
It's so nice to see "famous people" that don't get so full of themselves that they can't take time to talk to us little people!!

I got to meet Charlie a few years ago in Portland at the Micro Brew and Brew Pub Symposium, he's a great guy. I also got to meet and have a great conversation with Fred Eckhardt at the Chicago Real Ale Fest a few years back, quite the friendly fellah.

Heck, right here we have Stan Hieronymus and Neal Leathers (your own Moose Drool Daddy) gracing our company. Just goes to show that beer folk are good people!

Steve

[BucksBrew]

Update on Color: The beer is med golden in color. I thought it would be light gold. It was deceiving in the carboy. My FG is 1.20 @ 60 degrees so far, SG 1.05 This does not make me happy. I think I did not aerate it enough during racking into primary. Temp. control was tough too. Therfore yeast did not have a good enviroment to convert DME into alcohol. I think it will end up at 2% alc., I was expecting 4.77%

Overall I think it will be great, pretty clear and my friends won't care! Getting close to bottle. If not tonite, maybe tomorrow. 4 weeks in a bottle! patience........

I'm going to make a Brown Ale so I have something to drink soon! haha 2-3 weeks hopefully.

[paul84043]

Did you mean that you're final gravity was 1.02 versus a starting gravity of 1.05? That is not really too far off the mark, mine adjusted have come in around 1.018 and the alcohol content as far as I can tell is just fine. Keep on going, you may end up surprising yourself.

4 weeks in the bottle......yeah, I keep telling myself the very same thing...but somehow, my beers keep disappearing out of hte box in the basement....

[BucksBrew]

Paul, you are right about the numbers, my error.

My only concern was that the recipe says 3 weeks in the secondary and you should be fine. But yesterday was 4 weeks and I'm still getting burps anywhere from 25-45 seconds apart.

I guess so long as I get consistant readings with the hydro 3 days in a row it will be ok to bottle. Still a little confused about this scenario. I may wait and see. It is a lager yeast. To lager is to wait!

[paul84043]

The problem that i have heard from several people is that it could take a LONG time for all of the C02 to evolve out of the beer, even after the yeast has stopped functioning. So, you could have bubbling for quite a while after your fermentation is pretty much done.

I don't really understand either, I guess it will just take some time and probably a few mistakes to get up the learning curve.
I am in the same situation that you are in, trying to decide for myself when it's done.

[BucksBrew]

If fermentation is pretty much over and it is CO2 releasing, then I gotta go with my FG readings staying level for 3 days before I bottle.

[paul84043]

That's been my understanding as well, but it makes me nervous when I hear these other brewers that have been doing it for a long time say to wait an additional week......

You'd almost have to make two of the very same beers back to back and let one sit the extra week to see the difference for yourself.

[BucksBrew]

I'm going to wait. I don't want exploding bottles!

Plus I made another batch last night (bass Clone) and I have a Brown Ale kit ready and waiting.

I'll have three batches in the works soon.

When you first start brewing they don't tell you of Brewers "Lag Time" and everybody asking "Is it done yet?. haha

[paul84043]

I based my first two batches on the Hydrometer readings and bottled after a full week of fermentation because the reading was within a hundredth of a point of what it was supposed to be, and had been stable for 3+ days. (though it was still bubbling once every couple of minutes) Once the reading is stable, where else is there for it to go?

Both batches have been fine, no explosions, and my first batch has been slowly disappearing from the basement....basically it's damn good and I can't leave it alone. Also the carbonation is perfect...

The only thing I question is wether there is a real benefit to taste and overall quality if you wait....

I am not a patient person!!

Another thing that I am afraid of is that if you wait too long, and all of the yeast falls out of suspension, will there be any left to carbonate the beer?

Any more experienced brewers have any input for us newbies???

[BucksBrew]

I'm going with the FG readings as gospel!

Bottling or bust this weekend!