IPA Help

[hmpitags2006]

I need help with my recipe

7 lbs light unhopped malt extract
2 lb 2-row pale malted barley
1/2 lb cara-pils malted barley
1/2 lb medium crystal malted barley
1 cup light brown sugar
1 oz Chinook hops (bittering) 60 min
1 oz Norther Brewers hops (flavoring) 15 min
1/2 oz Kent Golding hops (finishing) 5 min
1/2 oz Kent Golding hops (fermenting)
1 pkg White Labs California Ale yeast WLP001
1/2 cup light brown sugar (priming)

Does this look ok? I am doing a recipe from a local brew supply shop, and I haven't ever used brown sugar in my brews. Also I haven't done a fermenting hop addition how do you do it and when should I do it? Also I haven't used brown sugar for priming either.

[danno]

1 cup of brown sugar in a five gallon batch is pretty insignificant, especially in an IPA. don't sweat it.

"fermenting" hop is what I would consider just a dry hop, add it when you rack to the secondary. I'd use a hop bag, and weight it down sith something. marbles, maybe... (and sanitize them and the bag...)

brown sugar works the same as corn sugar, but again, you'll get very little flavor from that amount, so I wouldn't go out of the way to use it instead of what you normally use to prime.

now, the hops is where I have some issues with this recipe. I didn't input any of the amounts into ProMash to check IBU's, but just the variety bugs me. first off, you need to decide what you're aiming for in this recipe. If you want an American IPA, then EKG is the wrong hop for aroma. if you would like more of an English IPA, then Northern Brewer is the wrong hop to use. (this is all IMO, in my opinion. others may disagree, and probaby should, and this could very possibly be the best tasting beer ever, but I'd pick a direction and focus your hop choices...)

edit: what do the instructions tell you to do with that 2-row? I have some concerns about that, too...

[Fir Na Tine]

I'd say with the 2-row, you're probably looking at doing a stove-top mash, along with the carapils and the crystal malts. You could forgo using the 2-row, substitute 1-2 pounds of light DME, then just steep the cara and the crystal if you'd like.

I'm agreeing with Danno on the hops. If you're going for more American, get rid of the Kent's, replace them with some Cascade or Centenial perhaps. If you're going English, try Fuggles, Challenger, or Target. All just suggestions of course.

The brown sugar won't do much of anything IMO.

[hmpitags2006]

I was playing around with beer smith and the IBU's came up to 44.3 which I have no idea what it means. I don't want an overly hoppy IPA, but I want it to be present. As far as English to American I just want something that will taste good. I do have 1 lb of DME laying around that I could use instead of the 2-row, the instructions were crap and didn't say what to do with each ingredient. I kind of just used logical reasoning to figure that out on my own.

[BrewDog]

If it's Breiss' brand CaraPils, then they (the company) say that it needs to be mashed in the presence of base malt. That's why the 2 row is there. Skipping the base malt and simply steeping the carapils will leave unconverted starches in the wort.
This is not a recipe that I would suggest for a typical first timer.

Here's one way to juggle those hops in this recipe to lower the bitterness a little bit and make it more to the style of an American India Pale Ale instead of being kind of a "mutt" IPA.

1 oz NB at 60 (bittering)
1/4 oz EKG at 20 (flavor)
1/4 oz Chinook 20(flavor)
1/4 oz EKG at 10 (flavor/aroma)
1/4 oz Chinook 10 (flavor/aroma)
1/4 oz EKG at 2 mins (aroma)
1/4 oz Chinook 2 mins (aroma)
1/4 oz EKG at dry hop in secondary (aroma)
1/4 oz Chinook dry hop in secondary (aroma)

(Assuming 13% chinook, 9% NB, & 4.75% EKG, 50% efficiency due to partial mash, and Briess' Gold LME)
According to Promash, doing it the original way yielded a 1.059 OG, 67.7 IBU brew. This is VERY bitter - 1.14 BU:GU ratio

Spreading the hop additions out like this yields a brew of 1.059, and 51.9 IBUs. 0.87 BU:GU ratio, which is still in the IPA range but not nearly as over the top as the original.

Chinook is much more potent flavor and aroma wise compared to EKG. Using them together across the flavor and aroma additions will lend more citrus to the end result. EKG is lighter and more subtle, so it will be present but masked behind the Chinook. While I haven't tried this combination before, my gut tells me this wouldn't be a bad way to combine those hops if:
1) you have already bought them.
2) don't want to go out and buy some more just yet
3) want to make a more "in-style" brew.

Hopefully somebody else will have more suggestions or comments on this approach.

Thoughts?

[hmpitags2006]

They crushed the grains for me so they are all mixed together, and I am guessing that this is a problem. The cara-pils is from the USA, and that's all I know about it. As far as the alphas for the hops the NB is 8.0, Kent Golding 6.9, Chinook is 11.6.

[hmpitags2006]

Ok I called them and they told me to just boil the grains for 20 min in the nylon baggie, which I think is wrong. The last time I brewed I did 155 degrees F for 45 min soaking the grains and dipping it in and out of the water like a tea bag, then add the extract, then bring to a boil. I will follow your hop suggestion time table. I guess I am not using beersmith right :p

[BrewDog]

DO NOT BOIL THE GRAIN- You are right that boiling grain is wrong. Those directions SUCK.

Just do it the way you did the last time, steep them in a grain bag for about 45 mins at 150F. I'd use 1.5 quarts per lb of grain, so -60in your case, 6 quarts. After they have steeped for 45 mins, rinse them with another 6 quarts or so of 160-170F (do not exceed 170F, though. Use a thermometer. Use that as the first part of your brewing water, then proceed with your boil from there.

Let us know how it goes.

[hmpitags2006]

Thanks brew dog

[Mad Scientist]

Originally posted by hmpitags2006
...and they told me to just boil the grains for 20 min in the nylon baggie.....

What damn brew store are you using? They should know better....

[hmpitags2006]

It is a new store that just opened up near Galveston, Tx. I think it turned out ok, the OG was 1.052, and tasted ok, just a little hoppy.

[Mad Scientist]

If they are dispensing advice...that they should know better, I'd just amke a trip up to DeFalcos...

[hmpitags2006]

Yeah I wouldn't mind going to de'falcos besides the fact it is about 65 miles from me.

[texasliam]

Did you end up making the dfh90, is it ready, are you bringing some over?

[Mad Scientist]

liam, thanks for reserrecting this thread. Did anyone ever correct that LHBS is Galveston?

[hmpitags2006]

Originally posted by Boerne Brew
liam, thanks for reserrecting this thread. Did anyone ever correct that LHBS is Galveston?

Boerne I am not sure what you are asking. That IPA turned out ok, but not great. That was also several months ago that I did that IPA. I made a IIPA DFH 90 Clone that was awesome just recently.

[brewmasterash]

hmpitags2006, I am planning to make the DFH 90 soon. I will likely use the recipe from BYO and maybe tweak it a bit. Can you give me any pointers? How long did you age it before drinking?
Thanks,
Ash

BTW, I will brew it AG.

[Mad Scientist]

Originally posted by hmpitags2006
Boerne I am not sure what you are asking. That IPA turned out ok, but not great. That was also several months ago that I did that IPA. I made a IIPA DFH 90 Clone that was awesome just recently.

I was referring to the directions of boiling the grains for 20 minutes, that Brwwdog said No! to.....

[hmpitags2006]

Originally posted by brewmasterash
hmpitags2006, I am planning to make the DFH 90 soon. I will likely use the recipe from BYO and maybe tweak it a bit. Can you give me any pointers? How long did you age it before drinking?
Thanks,
Ash

BTW, I will brew it AG.

I have their clone recipe as well but I didn't use it. I have the one I used I can pm it to you if you want. I am an avid 60 min and 90 min drinker and it tastes damn close. I aged it about 2 weeks after it was ready to drink. I dry hopped in a carboy which was a pain in the ass to get the bag that I put the hops in out of the bottle. I would suggest doing it in a bucket for easy removal.

-Glenn

[Mill Rat]

Originally posted by hmpitags2006
I dry hopped in a carboy which was a pain in the ass to get the bag that I put the hops in out of the bottle. It's not that tough to do. once you've transferred the beer out of the carboy, turn it upside down and get the knot end of the bag to fall through the neck. Untie the knot, and let the bag fall back in. Repeat the process, only this time get the seam end of the bag to the carboy neck. Hang onto that end and upright the carboy. The hops will fall out into the empty carboy, the bag will pull out, and you can then easily rinse the loose hops out of the carboy.

[brewmasterash]

Glenn, please do PM your recipe. I would be grateful. Wow, I would think it needed more aging. That is good news. I will probably brew it up in the next 3-4 weeks. I will let you know what I think.

Ash

[Mad Scientist]

Originally posted by Mill Rat
It's not that tough to do. once you've transferred the beer out of the carboy, turn it upside down and get the knot end of the bag to fall through the neck. Untie the knot, and let the bag fall back in. Repeat the process, only this time get the seam end of the bag to the carboy neck. Hang onto that end and upright the carboy. The hops will fall out into the empty carboy, the bag will pull out, and you can then easily rinse the loose hops out of the carboy.

Easier is just to put the in loose, then they fall out on their own.