Like Tetley Bitter

[jimmyk64]

While in London recently, we visited Blackfriar Pub and tasted Tetley Bitter. Now here at home in the US we've tried to find it, but have been told(by Tetley)they do not export Bitter to the USA.

Is there any British bitter imported to America that shares the same characteristics of Tetley Bitter?

[Richard English]

There are a few (John Smiths, for example).

However, Tetley (like John Smiths) is a poor drink by UK beer standards (although wonderful by A-B standards).

Try the wonderful bottle-conditioned ales such as Fuller's 1845; Hog's Back T.E.A; Young's Special London Ale. All of these are, I know, available in the USA as doubtless are many others.

Eschew anything made by the major brewers (which means most of the beers you'll see advertised) since they all, without exception, put profit before quality.

I have already posted a link to a site that gives details of most of the world's bottled beers.

Draught beers, of course, are a different matter and I don't know whose (if anyone's) are available over there. Again, anything widely advertised is likely to be poor and anything that is dispensed from a shiny font is also likely to be poor. English draught Real Ale is served direct from the cask (not a keg, by the way - that's something different) or by beer engine (handpump).

The beers you drank at the Black Friar would have been served by beer engine. By the way, did you try the other ales they had on offer? Usually they have Fuller's London Pride and Brakespears Special - both excellent ales.

[jimmyk64]

Thank you, Richard for your expedient reply.

Thew! Obviously my mate and I know VERY little about great beer. We were taken by the Tetley Bitter. I believe we sampled Fuller's 1845 at the Anchor, but aside from those two(and the Guinness)we are unable to remember any others we sampled.

Had dinner at the Grenadier one night, Bunch of Grapes a second night. Obviously missed out on their brew offerings.

When we return, The Black Friar is an intended stop, and we'll try London Pride and Brakespears Special then.

Thank you for your guidance. This weekend I'm off on a hunt for John Smiths, Young's Special London Ale and Hog's Back T.E.A. (any and all)

[Richard English]

Don't restrict your choice to those I've mentioned. We brew around 5000 different beers in the UK! Go to http://www.quaffale.org.uk/ for a list of all our breweries.

The Black Friar, although you might not have realised it, is a very interesting pub. It is probably the world's first "theme pub" since it was built to look like a medieval building but in fact, is not as old as Blackfriars railway station opposite, being built only towards the end of the 19th century.

[steveh]

I'll second the vote for Young's Special London Ale. My corner liquor store has just started stocking this beer in the 20 oz bottles and I tried it because it was new to me. Quite tasty.

Any of the Fullers products I've found here in the 'States have held up to import as well.

The Blackfriar is, indeed, a wonderful pub. I visited London some 6 years ago and still recall the coziness of that place. A friend is off on a long weekend to London this evening and I was sure to add the Blackfriar to his list of pubs.

In honor of his trip I'll hoist a half pint (or 3) at Chicago's Real Ale Fest tomorrow!

S.

[Richard English]

Just as a matter of interest, the pub is The Black Friar (two words) although that area of London is known as Blackfriars.

Where are your friends staying? There are some wonderful pubs in London - but there are some terrible ones as well - so they need to be careful. Generally speaking, anything with loud music, big-screen TV or rows of shiny fonts on the bar will be unlikely to serve good beer.

Look for the beer engines and make sure that the clips on the handles are showing outwards to the customers. Reversed pump clips means that this particular beer is not available. Any pub with two or more reversed clips is likely to be one that does not look after its beer - a good landlord keeps it turning over properly and will rarely have beers off.

[steveh]

Sorry for the misspelling - as I said, I've only been lucky enough to visit London once.

My friends are staying just to the west of Buckingham Palace, near Victoria Station - I believe the hotel is called the Winchester.

AFA pub seeking was planned, they are armed with the CAMRA guide and have been researching with the web at such sites as fancyapint.com.

They'll also be soliciting recommendations from the people at their hotel and the people they meet. They are not the type to be attracted by loud music and bright televisions - they're looking for tradition.

Thank you for the advice on the pump clips, I'll pass it along. What is the current status of the Cheshire Cheese? That was another pub I enjoyed - its history as much as its Samual Smith mild. I suggested this pub to them as well.

S.

[Richard English]

Ah yes.

Where they are staying is in the area we know as Pimlico. It's not a bad area and has some good restaurants, especially where Warwick Way meets Wilton Road. Oddly enough, though, the pubs aren't all that wonderful - especially the ones up Wilton Road towards Victoria Station.

There's a very good Young's house called the Buckingham, just near the junction of Petty France with Buckingham Gate. It's about ten minute's walk from where they are. The Landlord (Eugene) looks after his beer well.

The Cheshire Cheese is still there, although it's a bit "touristy" as it does to some extent capitalise on its status as one of the oldest pubs in London, having been built after the Great Fire in 1666. It's far from being the oldest pub in England, of course - that honour goes the The Trip to Jerusalem (in Nottingham) which is nearly 500 years older than the Cheshire Cheese.

An interesting pub, not too far from them is the Ship and Shovell, under the railway viaduct at Charing Cross. Named after Sir Cloudesly Shovell, it is one of the few in the area still to have its entrance gaslit. That would be about 25 minutes walk.

I hope they enjoy themselves - the weather this weekend is quite good - warm but wet, so an umbrella would be handy.

[steveh]

Richard,
Thanks for all of the London advice, I'll pass it along to my friends - now I wish I was going with them!

They'll be happy to hear about the Young's pub as I told them that one of my favorite beers I tried while there was the Young's Oatmeal Stout.

S.

[Richard English]

Young's bottled beers are fine, but their draught beers are, to my mind, better. Tell your friends not to restrict their choice to the bottled beers (in fact, the choice of bottled beers in most pubs in England is poor) but to try the draught.

After all, you can get Young's bottled beers in the USA but you can't get easily their draught beers.

[steveh]

Most agreed. I would only suggest draught beer in London - and I would only suggest real ale as well! Although I strayed at one pub that had some German Lagers I'd never tried.

Yes, imported bottled beer is more common in the U.S., but the draught, even the hand pump, is becoming a more common sight over here. There is a "beer bar" near me that even has Young's Double Chocolate Stout on draught! What a treat. I've tried that in both bottle and widget-ized can, and they don't hold up to the fresh draught.

If you ever get a chance to visit Chicago, I can recommend some good pubs for you.

S.

[Richard English]

Thank you.

I chat to a friend in Chicago who has just discovered proper beer (after years of imagining that A-B made beer) and she is now working her way through all the English Ales she can find!

She sometimes looks at this board and I must ask her whether she's going to the Chicago Beer Festival.

You have the better of us if you have Young's Stout on draught; it's not available that way in England. We have very few draught stouts - mild or bitter are the favourite draught beers here.

[jimmyk64]

Hello, Richard:

Thank you for your response. And the link to quaffale.

Could you tell me what A-B refers to?

Also, when we return to London, we will be staying in Kensington, probably at the Beaufort. When last we stayed there, they really couldn't "recommend" pubs in the neighborhood because their guests are usually only interested in four star restaurants. Aside from the Grenadier, are there any other noteworthy pubs in Kensington?

Regards,

[Richard English]

Hello again. A-B = Anheuser-Busch!

I am not an expert on Kensington pubs as it's not an area I use very much. As you have intimated, it's very expensive and most locals would tend not to go there.

The Grenadier, though, is an exception. It's a fine boozer and quite unspoilt. Some Americans obviously find it (maybe it's on their itineraries) since the last time I was there I saw two separate groups of American visitors, both exchanging tales of "back home"!

It might be worthwhile your getting a copy of the CAMRA guide if you don't already have one. Go to http://www.camra.org.uk/ to get details.

[jimmyk64]

One of those groups may have been us!

[Richard English]

I did wonder when I posted! The last time I was in that boozer would probably have been last year - possibly November.

[beerguy]

Hello jimmyk64 -
Although this pub isn't in Kensington, it isn't too far away by tube, and in my opinion, well worth the trip. It is called The Dove in Hammersmith. It is a Fuller's owned pub right on the side of the Thames and is equally good on a hot summer day or a blistery winter evening. Here is an article at www.beertravelers.com (mostly talking about real ale in the U.S.) but gives some overview of the place http://www.beertravelers.com/indexes/wateringholes/real_ale.html

There are also other nice pubs, particularly in the summertime, along The Strand in Chiswick which isn't far from The Dove.

Pat

[jimmyk64]

Thank you for the advise, Pat.

With transAtlantic fares at the price they are now, we're talking again of revisiting London. So it's a treat to find the expert pub advice I'm seeing here!

Regards,

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
I chat to a friend in Chicago who has just discovered proper beer (after years of imagining that A-B made beer) and she is now working her way through all the English Ales she can find!

She sometimes looks at this board and I must ask her whether she's going to the Chicago Beer Festival.

You have the better of us if you have Young's Stout on draught; it's not available that way in England. We have very few draught stouts - mild or bitter are the favourite draught beers here.

If your friend was at the RAF, I hope she had a good time. 212 beers available, the majority of them cask conditioned ales - Hopback Brewing made a good showing and their ales survived the trip across the ocean in good flavor. I'm also happy that you set your friend straight on good beer - it always feels good to "convert" someone and show them what they've been missing.

On my trip to London, we visited a Young's house on our last night before heading home. I can't recall its name, but it was near the Tavistock Square area. They had the oatmeal stout on draught and I worked my way through the bitter to the special bitter to the stout - getting the stout at last call. I kicked myself silly for not having enjoyed the stout all night, even the whole trip! It was delicious!

S.

[Richard English]

On Young's own website they say of Oatmeal Stout "...Brewed by Young's exclusively for sale in United States..." Certainly I have never seen it in the UK, especially on draught. Young's Double Chocolate Stout is available bottled but not on draught.

Was it, perchance, Winter Warmer that you drank? That's a dark (but not black) rather malty strong ale which is available in the winter months.

As I said, there are very few stouts available on draught in England - the most common is Guinness, of course, but some pubs take Murphy's. Neither Guinness nor Murphy's are Real Ales by CAMRA's definition.

The pub you visited - was it the Lamb in Lamb's Conduit Street?

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
On Young's own website they say of Oatmeal Stout "...Brewed by Young's exclusively for sale in United States..." Certainly I have never seen it in the UK, especially on draught. Young's Double Chocolate Stout is available bottled but not on draught.

Only for the U.S.? Is it possible that they started this practice since I visited London? I can't be sure without looking up some old photos and records, but I believe I was there in Spring of 1996. I am very certain that it was the Oatmeal Stout - I enjoy them very much and was saving a favorite for last. When it was so delicious, it made a huge impression. I'll have to do some more research on this.

I wouldn't expect Guinness or Murphy's to be real ale, even though enjoyable once in a while.

The Lamb sounds correct. Is it a fairly large pub? Two levels separated by a short flight of 4 stairs, ornate bar on the main level? We were staying at the Tavistock Inn (again, my memory fogs on exact name) and the pub was within easy walking distance.

S.