brewing and global warming

[corkybstewart]

I've been curious about how much brewing adds to the CO2 in the atmosphere. Does anybody have any idea what volume of CO2 is produced by a standard 5 gallon batch of average gravity beer?

[Jeff]

Are we talking just from the process, such as boiling, refrigeration etc. or everything?

Everything as in, growing the barley and hops, malting and processing the hops, yeast cultivation, shipping. Manufacturing of the equipment, getting the gas out of the ground and sending it to the local distribution system....and we could go on and on and on.

I will look up my number tomorrow. I can tell you how many pounds of CO2 are generated per kwh of electricty produced, but that number varies depending on who you ask.

[corkybstewart]

I'm curious about just the fermentation process, but it all really does add up.
I was listening to a program on NPR last week talking about how ethanol really isn't the answer as a gasoline substitute. That got me thinking about making ethanol and I realized just turning corn into ethanol must put a bunch of CO2 into the atmosphere.

[BrewDog]

Just think how much energy it takes just to hit mash temps.

Funny how kumbaya it sounds until you start looking at the details.

I've also heard that the Mars ice caps are receding. I guess it's all the SUV's on Mars causing global warming there, too.
Why isn't Radio Communisto, uh, I mean NPR, reporting anything on that?

[brazilhead]

I know we´re getting of the subject here but if I understood that last post correctly, SUVs don´t contribute to global warming and only a communist would say they do. Please tell me I got that wrong.

Anyway, I´ve often felt a bit bad about how much water I use to brew. Still, as far as the CO2 caused by fermentation, we´d still be drinking beer even if we didn´t brew and at least it´s not brought to us by trucks. And then at least it´s not fermented and then distilled...

[Jared]

Remember the co2 that is produced was once in the air itself untill the the plant (barley in this case) took it up and stored it in complex starches. By brewing beer, the fermentation proccess simply releases the co2.

This is much different then burning fossil fuels. these hydrocarbons have been trapped underground for millions of years instead of trapped in barley for just a few months/years.

http://www.safeclimate.net/business/understanding/carboncycle.php

[HogieWan]

I'm with Jared - that co2 released came from somewhere. I personally think global warming gets too much of the wrong kind of attention

[vw addict]

I'm definately not going to stop brewing because I may be contributing to global warming. I figure my car that gets 30 mpg, and the fact I ride my bike to work most days combined with my homebrewing still puts me under what a family driving an SUV around contributes.:D

[barleyburps]

I also am not too worried about global warming. . .the earth goes through cycles of ice ages and temperate conditions at its own pace. I honestly think that whatever we are doing to its atmostphere is probably of minor significance in the big picture.

[corkybstewart]

My personal belief is that we're not dealing with the same old cyclical stuff. You can't keep pouring this much crap into the air without it having an effect.
But I really wasn't trying to start this debate. I'm just curious about the volume of CO2 produced by fermenting 5 gallons of wort. I have no intention of stopping brewing, just intellectual curiousity.

[barleyburps]

Well. I know If I owned a big brewery with deep pockets, I would definitely be trying to measure it and capture what I could to re-use in the aging tanks. . . .

[surfadelic23]

I always worried more about the water usage too. Now, I use a wortchiller that pulls water from my pool filter system, runs through the chiller and back to the pool. All waste water ends up in the pool too. I figure every little bit helps...
I probably do more damage driving the 1/2 hour to the liquor store and back...

[corkybstewart]

I use my runoff to first fill buckets for cleanup water, then I water trees with the rest of it. I'sm using a "prechiller" in a tub of ice to chill my beer faster and use less water, but I do agree it's a problem. Especially where I live, my water bill is outrageous and I don't water lawn, only trees(and hops of course). I use a water well for the small patch of grass behind the house.

Maybe we should push for CO2 scrubbers on all exhausts for the BMC breweries. That might cause them to raise their prices enough that people will start drinking beer from smaller, local breweries. Or at least make them divert money from their ad budgets to legal budgets. Just kidding of course...

[BrewDog]

Sorry to get off on a tangent. Global warming is one of those subjects that really pisses me off due to its complete and utter lack of impartial scientific reporting by a biased media with an agenda.

[corkybstewart]

If I were you I'd ignore the media and do a little research. I've been reading about it in science related magazines for almost 20 years now.
But pour yourself a nice beer and relax before you start reading.

I've invested 26 years in a career in oil and gas exploration. I have a vested interest in things not changing, but I'd give this carer up in a heartbeat if we found another way to move people thaen petroleum.

[Cosmic Charlie]

Anyone see the tour of New Belgium on Basic Brewing video? They filter their cleaning solution before returning it to the water supply, and they're able to use some of what they filter to generate a little electricity of their own.

[HarkJohnny]

i just believe that the seasons are all changing on us, or rather shifting slightly

[corkybstewart]

Originally posted by Cosmic Charlie
Anyone see the tour of New Belgium on Basic Brewing video? They filter their cleaning solution before returning it to the water supply, and they're able to use some of what they filter to generate a little electricity of their own.

I read somewhere that thier new brewery is trying to get as "green" as possible. That's great.

[Jeff]

Okay so I finally looked up the number. Take a kwh and multiply it by 1.6. That will give you lbs of CO2. I believe this number is based on primarily coal power generation.

Now for the propane gas burner. How many brewing cycles can you get out of a 20lb propane tank?

[corkybstewart]

Jeff, I hate to sound stupid(I'm actually pretty good at it) but where should a take this "kwh". In other words I translate it as kilowatt hour, but this makes no sense to me in terms of of gas coming out of a fermenter.

[Jeff]

Corky, slight misunderstanding. I thought we were still looking at the total process of brewing at home. I was giving a number for how much carbon dioxide is generated to give your house 1 kilowatt hour of electricty.

How much CO2 comes out while fermenting? I like science and nerdy stuff, but that might stretch the limit. :)

[Sladek]

Originally posted by BrewDog
I've also heard that the Mars ice caps are receding. I guess it's all the SUV's on Mars causing global warming there, too.
Why isn't Radio Communisto, uh, I mean NPR, reporting anything on that? Oh, how clever.

[SirVeza]

Hi,

Interesting thread.

Looking a home brewing as a system, I'm sure there are lots of little ways you can save the planet or save yourself some money, however you like to look at it.

I have a solar water pre-heater that I made from cardboard and foil. I also use it for kilning my barley. Perhaps you could run the hose around the grass and let the sun shine on it.

The first few minutes of spent water from your wort chiller could be fed into a picnic cooler and used to wash up after brewing.

Hey why couldn't you capture all that lovely CO2 that yeast makes in fermenting and use it to pressure up your keg?

Composting your spent grain? Collecting methane gas from it? Any other ideas?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Dan Carol
Homebrewing In The Philippines (http://homebrewinghobby.blogspot.com/)

[dparsons]

Just to comment on another theory of global warming that isn't in vogue: it has to do more with water vapor and not CO2. Water vapor maxes out in concentration and puts a cap on the warming. This theory supposedly provides a better match on the data taken over the past several years/decades. The CO2 people have been continually adjusting their model over the past few decades to account for the continued overprediction of the effect. You don't hear about this in the news - likely because it would reduce the funding that careers are based on.