Fuller's Porter

[Richard English]

Fuller's are doing a few special brews right now and yesterday I had a pint of their Porter (on draught, of course).

As I would expect from Fuller's it was an excellent pint and much more full-bodied than I would have expected from a Porter. Indeed, it was more heavy than some stouts I have drunk.

Not a session beer, that's for sure, but an excellent drink for the cooling nights we are now experiencing.

Next week they are rolling out 1845 on draught and I am very much looking forward to sampling that. Hard to imagine that it will be better than the bottled variety but, as Fuller's draught beers are usually even better than their bottled ones, even that's possible!

[steveh]

Richard - are either the Porter or the 1845 cask conditioned, or to be offered in CC form?

S.

[homebrewaddict]

Hey Richard,

How long is Fullers going to be doing this? I have a trip to England planned for the end of November and am now hoping that I can get some 1845 on tap! What do you think?

[Richard English]

Two points:

ALL Fuller's draught ales are cask conditioned; they don't make any other kind. 1845 is bottle-conditioned as we know but their other bottled beers are not.

The Fuller's autumn beer festival is on until November but exactly when it finishes depends, I suspect, on when the special brews are finished!

You can find out more at www.fullers.co.uk. When you get there click on beers, then on brands and then on the banner for the Autumn beer festival. 1845 goes on sale on October 20 and many of their London pubs have ordered it.

I suspect that it will all have gone by the end of November but you can keep your fingers crossed!

[steveh]

Originally posted by Richard English
Two points:
ALL Fuller's draught ales are cask conditioned; they don't make any other kind.

That's what I thought, but I was surprised you'd be concerned that the draught 1845 wouldn't be as good as the bottled variety - but I see that was more anticipatory than anything.

Enjoy, you sure have me salivating!

S.

[chazwicke]

I heard about the porter on the Draught UK or scoopgens board. There was some grumblings there that it was over priced but good. 1845 on cask could only be wonderful.

[sallad]

i can only imagine 1845 cask conditioned.... but since it is a BCA, is the yeast in the bottle the primary yeast? i've been thinking about harvesting some for my future english style ales.... any info anyone?

[Richard English]

The draught version of 1845 will be similar to the bottled version but the yeast dosage will be greater. Here's what they say about it in the Fuller's Fine Ale Club magazine:

"Being bottle-conditioned, 1845 is already a cask beer in a bottle. The notable difference here is that the cask version will contain more yeast, enabling the beer to mature faster. In bottle, 1845 matures very slowly over time, the flavour developing for up to two years after bottling. In cask the beer will only be stored for up to 30 days so the extra yeast is needed to mature the beer faster"

It goes on sale this Sunday!

I don't know whether they use a special secondary yeast; in the cask this would probably be unecessary since sediment is not an issue, but I don't know about in the bottle.

You could try asking Fullers www.fullers.co.uk

[chazwicke]

Well Richard, I am anxiously waiting for your report on the 1845. Have you sampled it yet?

[steveh]

Me too! Don't leave us hanging! Of course, maybe he doesn't want to tell us how good it is for fear of an influx of tourists to drink it all! ;)

I bought a bottle of the Fullers' London Porter over the weekend. Deep, deep ruby color, thick white to tan head. Great caramely malt in the nose with faint fruity esters and some diacetyl coming through. Hops? Hmm, there, but not terribly significant beyond the malt.

The flavor was rich and malty with the same caramel and butterscotch flavors, along with the slightest of fruitiness and hops in the finish. Of note - the diacetyl/butterscotch flavors were not an unpleasant mix with the rich maltiness. A fine beer, I can only imagine (longingly) how the draught must taste!

S.

[Richard English]

Yesterday moring my system would not log on and I spent most of the day trying to find out why. BT have finally suggested that my USB modem might be faulty and I am awaiting a call.

This means I haven't been able to answer or report and am only doing so now because I am using my assistant's computer and webmail to pick up my messages.

Anyway, I haven't tried the 1845 yet since the nearest Fuller's pub is some way away and I will need to make a special journey. The next time I shall be sure to be in a pub selling draught 1845 will be on Friday when I'll pop into the Churchill Arms in Kensington (said by some to be the best pub in the world!)

I promise I'll post my findings on Saturday or before if I land on a Fuller's pub that stocks draught 1845 before then. I will be using one tonight - in Dorking - but it's not on Fuller's list as stockist.

[chazwicke]

I have been to the Churchill Arms on several occasions and agree it is a fine pub. The Thai food is said to be good there as well, although I have not tasted it myself. I have just enjoyed Fullers there. I think it was pub of the year in 1999.

[Richard English]

Last night I popped into the Cricketers in Dorking and he hadn't yet put his 1845 on ad he still have some Porter left. As he only had four engines, and the other three were already serving his regulars - Chiswick, Pride and ESB, he was having to wait until he'd sold out of Porter. Next Wednesday, apparently.

I'll try the Churchill tomorrow night and see how I get on there. Today I'm in London but not near a Fuller's house so won't be able to check. I'll be having a couple of pints of Young's at the Buckingham (envy me, Chaswicke!)

[chazwicke]

I do! I do!

[steveh]

Careful...last time I used that phrase so enthusiastically, I was in a world of hurt for 5 years!! ;)

S.

[chazwicke]

Good one Steveh. Actually I am planning to go to London again in May and possibly in February. The pub Richard mentioned is a fine Young's pub in the Victoria area. (there are pictures of the Queen Mum and Prince Charles having and pouring pints in the Buckinham adorning one of the walls) I believe it and the Britannia in Kensington are possibly the two best Young's pubs I've been in. Richard recommended it to me last visit.

[steveh]

I wish I could remember all of the pubs I visited in London when there; The Friend at Hand, The Black Friar, The Cheshire Cheese, King Lud (Ludd?), The White Horse - there were plenty right around Trafalgar Square that were wonderful. My friends had made friends on previous trips with the owners and operators of The Two Chairmen (the TC off Trafalgar), so we spent much time in there.

My favorite Fuller's pub was the one right at the brewery, and my favorite Young's pub was The Lamb (IIRC) close to our hotel at Tavistock Square.

We also got out to Salisbury and visited The Haunch of Venison - a wonderful place! And Hopback - great beer and people there. There was a terrific pub in downtown Salisbury that had about 8 - 12 gravity fed cask ales - as well as a handful of great Belgians on tap none of had ever heard of!

Someday I'll get back to England, for now - I hear Munich calling as I haven't been there in a while. Maybe this Spring.

S.

[chazwicke]

I also like the the The Two Chairman and I think I may have been one or two of the others. I've been to Salisbury a couple of times too. I love the Salisbury Cathedral. Have you ever eaten at the Haxenaur in Munich? Superb! But hopefully on my next trip to Germany I will make it back to Bamberg.

[hopjack13]

well i envy all of you....i've only left the U.S.A. three times ,all to mexico, and the beer sucks in mexico!

[Richard English]

All good pubs and the Two Chairmen in particulary typifies what is so unusual and wonderful about London and its pubs. Although the pub is very close to Trafalcar Square - a major tourist attraction and as near to the centre of one of the world's largest cities as it could be, when you step into the pub it's just as if you were in a backstreet local in a village somewhere. Small, slightly scruffy and almost unchanged in fifty years, it's an excellent example of what makes English pubs unique.

If you're near Leicester Square, the Tom Cribb, in Panton Street, is another fine pub (although it can get crowded).

[steveh]

Originally posted by chazwicke
I also like the the The Two Chairman and I think I may have been one or two of the others. I've been to Salisbury a couple of times too. I love the Salisbury Cathedral. Have you ever eaten at the Haxenaur in Munich? Superb! But hopefully on my next trip to Germany I will make it back to Bamberg.

Aren't there a couple Two Chairmen in London? Richard describes to a tee the particular establishment we frequented. Very cozy and friendly - although I *did* have to defend myself for drinking 'alf pints! I had to explain that I was sampling double of everyone else, so I was coming out even in the end! ;)

Yes, the cathedral in Salisbury is outstanding. Quite unbelievable for its age. It's amazing to stand there, looking at that architecture, and try to put yourself into, what? The year 1250?

I've never eaten at the Haxenaur, where abouts in the city is it? My favorite restaurant is probably the Schneiderhaus. The Lowenbrau Keller is good too, as well as the Augustiner Keller.

Bamberg is an easy train ride from Munich, but when I go back I'll probably be drawn back to Berchtesgaden - just to sit in their Hofbrau Biergarten and contemplate the looming mountains...and possibly flirt with the Irish Biermaids!

S.

PS - we should probably transfer this thread to the Travel section now!

[Richard English]

There's also a "Crown and two Chairmen" if I remember rightly - I think it's in Soho.

[Richard English]

Yesterday evening I popped into the Churchill to try the 1845 - and, guess what, they didn't have it. Maybe next week, I understand. I met a chap from Denver who was also trying to get a pint and he's on his way home today so I imagine he never managed.

I was rather disappointed in the Churchill having heard so much about it. Certainly I wouldn't consider it the "best pub in the world" (which appellation I have heard used to describe it). Indeed, I wouldn't even call it the best pub in West London.

To start with the lass behind the bar, athough very attractive and reasonably efficient, did not even know that the Fuller's beer festival was on - even though there was a poster advertising the fact on the window in front of her. Then she didn't know that the 1845 was even to be available on draught, and certainly not when it would be arriving.

The pub itself had a "mock" look about it. In spite of its supposed Churchill connection there was very little Churchilliana, just a picture and a few WW2-related items. There was much emphera around but following no special theme (apart from the large collection of chamber pots - jerries, guzunders, pos - I don't know what you call them in the USA). Most of what was there had obviously been obtained from junk shops or fairs as a job lot and simply put into place with little thought as to its appropriateness.

This is the way in which mock "Real Olde Worlde Englishe Pubs" are created in other countries and any English pub enthusiast will see through the device.

As I said, not a bad pub but far from being wonderful.

And I've still not had my 1845!

[chazwicke]

Hello Richard, Where are you? Have not seen any recent posts. We have been patiently waiting your report on the Fullers Draught 1845. Hope everything is OK.

[Richard English]

I did say that I was away for a while and have only today returned from Mallorca. Awful beer but a good conference.

Every Fuller's house I've been to so far hadn't yet put its draught 1845 on (I was told the Porter was so popular that they decided to brew another batch and the pubs have been using that up first)

However, if not before, I will be in The Victoria next Tuesday and will than get a chance to try it.

Hopefully, though, I'll manage to try some earlier and I will obviously post as soon as I've tasted it.

[Richard English]

Well, at last I've tried it. The Victoria (the only pub I've seen so far that's had it) had 1845 on draught Tuesday evening and I had a couple of pints.

As I would have expected, a very good pint whose flavour was very similar to that of the bottled drink. Being cask conditioned it was less gassy than the bottled version and a little warmer than most of us probably taste our bottled 1845.

Strangly it tasted rather stronger than does the bottled version, even though the strengths are supposed to be the same. Bottled 1845, as we all know, is a dangerously easy beer to quaff that doesn't immediately reveal its strength. The draught version also seemed to taste very slightly sweeter, although that may have had something to do with the lesser gassiness and warmer serving temperature.

All in all an excellent beer but one that would probably not be my first choice in a Fuller's house. I would probably go for the London Pride (or the Chiswick if I were in the mood for four or five pints). However, 1845 is still my first choice in bottled beers; I prefer it to bottled London Pride (which is not bottle-conditioned, of course).

One reason for this might be the drinking scenario. Drinking at home on my own I will have one or two bottles - three if I'm really in the mood - and that's less than three Imperial pints. In the pub I would almost always have three pints or more in a good session. So the stronger beers tend to be less attractive to me in a pub environment simply because I can drink fewer of them.

[chazwicke]

Well I am glad you finally found it. I have been waiting for your report. The bottle conditioned 1845 that we can get is excellent. Thank you for recommending it. Lately I have been enjoying Conniston Blue Bird bottle conditioned.

[Richard English]

Coniston Bluebird (named after Malcom Campbell's water speed record contender in which he was killed) is en excellent beer and, being of lower gravity, is a better session beer than 1845.

It is also available on draught and is even better that way. I have drunk it at the brewery tap (on Coniston Water) where is at its very best (they talk about this on the bottle label)

[chazwicke]

I have had it on cask and it is indeed a fine brew. I am pleased that I can get it here BC. It has become my home session beer of choice. I am worried that I may only have one left in my fridge. I hope my local beer store got more in as I bought all of it from the shelf last Saturday. I would love to have it at the brewery. I already have my flight booked for May (7th - 16th) to visit The UK. I am still trying to decide if I'll visit there in February or if it will be Germany. And if all goes well, I may be back for GBBF 2004.

[Richard English]

Excellent. Where will you be staying? I might be able to slot in some time for a few.

[chazwicke]

Working on lodging now. I may be staying in a flat or condo rather than a hotel this time. Most likely in the Kensington area. ( I like Victoria area too.) I have a friend who arranges for that sort of accomodation as part of her job and she is working on it for me. I'll definitely keep you posted as I certainly enjoyed spending the afternoon with you at GBBF and I would like show my appreciation for all of your recommendations by buying you a few pints.

[Richard English]

As things are predicted, I'll be working in Victoria on 11, 12 and 13 May - about five minutes from the Buckingham Arms. Having said which, it's easy enough to get around on the tube so Kensington's quite easy too.

If I were intending to stay in a flat or other lodging I think I'd prefer Pimlico (at the back of Victoria) rather than Kensington. It's a major residential area and probably cheaper than Kensington.

[Bryant]

Originally posted by Richard English
Fuller's are doing a few special brews right now and yesterday I had a pint of their Porter (on draught, of course).

As I would expect from Fuller's it was an excellent pint and much more full-bodied than I would have expected from a Porter. Indeed, it was more heavy than some stouts I have drunk.

Not a session beer, that's for sure, but an excellent drink for the cooling nights we are now experiencing.



That sounds great Sir Richard !! I am a porter fan, but I enjoy either a fuller bodied porter or one with generous amounts of chocolate malt. Even in my area Fuller's ESB is available to me (and it is very good) so I will ask about the availability of the porter.

Bryant

[homebrewaddict]

Well, my trip to England is fast approaching. And I was wondering if there is going to be any Fuller's specials left by the time I get there? The dates are 27 Nov to 4 Dec. Please tell me they haven't sold out yet (and won't in the next couple of weeks!)

[Richard English]

Well, the 1845 was the last of the special brews so you might be lucky enough to get some of that. I suspect the Porter will be gone, though.

Remember, English cask ales have a very limited life - just a few weeks - and if they're not sold they just turn into vinegar.

You could check on the Fuller's site and ask them whether they have any thoughts about further brews.

Having said which, you'll not be disappointed by their usual range of draught beers - nor by those from Youngs.

Make sure you ask the advice of a local as to the best pub in your area since the condition of the beer (like the taste of the food in a restaurant, will depend on the ability of the publican.

[chazwicke]

Originally posted by homebrewaddict
Well, my trip to England is fast approaching. And I was wondering if there is going to be any Fuller's specials left by the time I get there? The dates are 27 Nov to 4 Dec. Please tell me they haven't sold out yet (and won't in the next couple of weeks!)

Where will you be staying? maybe we can recommend a good Fullers pub close by. I envy your being there so soon. In General and IMHO English cask beer just cannot be topped.

[homebrewaddict]

I am staying at the Luna Simone Hotel located at

47-49, Belgrave road London, Westminster SW1 United Kingdom.

If anyone can recommend any good pubs nearby, that would be great. Otherwise I will take Richard's advice and ask a local.

[Richard English]

There are plenty of good pubs in that area. Try

'JUGGED HARE'
172 Vauxhall Bridge Road, Victoria, LONDON SW1V 1DX

'STAR TAVERN'
6 Belgrave Mews West, LONDON SW1 8HH

(both Fullers)

FOX AND HOUNDS
29 Passmore Street

RISING SUN
46 Ebury Bridge Road

A little further away (about ten minutes walk) definitely try
THE BUCKINGHAM ARMS
62 Petty France

(All Youngs)

[stronk]

I went to the fuller's brewery pub to find some porter on tap, but I forgot it was closed on weekends (which was really annoying). I went to the George and something nearby. You'd have thought that (being 200 metres from the brewery and being a Fuller's pub) they'd have 1845 and London porter, but the guy behind the bar claimed he had never seen london porter on tap and I had a draught ESB and a chiswick bitter (which were very nice, all the same).

[Richard English]

It all depends when you went.

Both Porter and 1845 were brewed to be served on draught only during the months of September and October 2003. Three Fuller's beers were produced - Honeydew, Porter and 1845 and were brewed consecutively.

Thus a pub could not take the Porter until it had finished the Honeydew nor the 1845 until it had finished the Porter. To make matters even more confusing, not all pubs took these special brews and it is probable that the one you visited was just one such.

The festival is now over and the pubs will be using up their stock. How long the 1845 will remain depends on how thirsty their customers are but I doubt it'll be for more than another week. So those who've missed out will just have to make do with Fuller's normal draught range or take the Porter, or the 1845 in bottle.

Incidentally, Fullers is a brewery, not a brewpub, and as such does not keep to normal pub hours. It is possible to take a brewery tour (as it is of the Youngs brewery - probably a more interesting place) but you need to book in advance.

[stronk]

I wonder when they'll be brewing draught porter and 1845 again. I can't believe I live in London and yet missed them.

[Beaver]

The London Porter pours a dark brown with ruby highlights. It has a smallish brown head that quickly goes down to a thin film and then completely disappears.

Its aroma is chocolate and caramel malts and some dry, chalky toffee / butterscotch.

The flavor is acidic, bitter chocolate with some caramel malts and a strong butterscotch flavor. The butterscotch became a little overwhelming as it warmed - both in flavor and aroma. It has a chalky, slightly bitter finish. It is thinner than I expected and under-carbonated.

Overall, I was expecting a lot from this, and was very disappointed. I've had much better porters. I wonder if I had a bad bottle - it is 3 months before the best by date though.

[Jeff]

I don't have any specefic tasting notes, but I don't remember the butterscotch being so overwhelming as you suggest Beaver. The last bottle I had (approximately a week ago) had a best before date of February of 2003 and was still excellent.

I am especially suprised that it was still so good since it is not bottle conditioned, anybody have any thoughts?

I will try the Porter again soon and take notes, but it will be my last bottle as it is no longer availabe in my area. :(