Young's Oatmeal Stout

[skahtboi]

I was checking out the Young's website today, as a result of another Young's posting on Realbeer, and noticed they no longer list the Oatmeal Stout in their list of brews. I began having trouble finding it around here a couple of years back, but would have never dreamed that they would discontinue brewing this fine beer. Anyone have any information as to why they quit brewing it??? This was my absolute favorite of their products.

[stronk]

Hang on. I take it the other Young's posting you mean was mine? In the same 30 seconds I was refused a Young's Pilsner, I was refused an Oatmeal Stout. However, they didn't say that it has stopped being brewed, just that it was off at that moment (the tap next to me was still labelled Oatmeal Stout).

I don't think they have stopped brewing it, but I wouldn't be that surprised if they did. After all, if they were forced to drop pilsner, I can't imagine there's that much more of a demand for oatmeal stout.

Young's have recently been forced to sell their London brewery and are now brewing on another brewery's premises. Perhaps that's the reason for the cutback. Tragic, I agree, but there are better London brewers.

[sundontlie]

i used to love the widget cans of double chocolate stout until someone told me to think about bubble gum while taking a sip, and from that moment on i could never drink one again. it tasted so much like bubble gum it made me feel sick

[steveh]

I've never, ever found bubblegum character in Young's DBL Choco - widget, bottle, or tap. That's weird.

Now Hacker-Pschorr Hefe, that's a different story.

Has it been confirmed that the Dbl Choco is a casualty of the brewery changes? From what I understand, that was brewed only for the US.

And Stronk, I'm surprised (but happy) to hear the Oatmeal is on tap in England once again. It was the last beer I had in a pub when I visited nearly 10 years ago and I'd heard that they had stopped making it available in anything other than bottles.

S.

[stronk]

I had it in a Young's pub down the road from me in Oxford. I haven't seen it anywhere else. I agree about Young's DCS and lack of bubblegum, Steve. As for availability of DCS, I can still buy it online, so I presume they're still producing it. It would be a silly thing to drop, IMO, as it's one of their more famous beers.

[D0nc0smic]

i've seen the Double Chocolate stout in grocery stores around here lately

[fretlessman71]

I could never get a taste for it. I think Brooklyn's Black Chocolate Stout is superior.

[D0nc0smic]

oh i think Brooklyns is too, but they are really 2 totally different styles as far as i am concerned even if they are both called chocolate stout

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by D0nc0smic
oh i think Brooklyns is too, but they are really 2 totally different styles as far as i am concerned even if they are both called chocolate stout

Very different.

Brooklyn uses no actual chocolate in the recipe, but uses several dark(er) malt varieties to achieve its flavors. It's also a 10% abv RIS.

Young's uses chocolate malt and real chocolate (syrup?) and is also closer to 5% abv.

Both have their time & place.

[steveh]

Originally posted by stronk
I agree about Young's DCS and lack of bubblegum,

Had a bottle last night to see if subliminal suggestion would bring out any Bazooka Joe. Nada, nothing but chocolate, roasted malt, a touch of vanilla, and some earthiness - probably from hops. Tasty stuff (no matter what Mr. Porter thinks). ;)

S.

[skahtboi]

Hmm...it seems my question regarding Young's Oatmeal Stout has somehow morphed into a thread about Young's DCS.

[fretlessman71]

THA - Thread Hijack Alert! ;)

Okay - everyone is on alert to check their local paint store and see if they have Young's Oatmeal Stout on the shelf, and ask the manager what they know about its whereabouts...

[jesskidden]

Yeah, I have to say that I've been buying a lot of singles of the Young's beers that are being dropped (esp. the Dirty Dick's) with the move to Wells' brewery- in NJ there's a lot of beer from two last months of the Ram brewery on the shelves and it's priced quite nicely, too. One tends to neglect certain beers, because they used to seem "always available".

The odd thing I noticed is that the Young's beers are listed on both the Young's site AND the Wells site, but not vice versa- click on "Our Beers" at http://www.charleswells.co.uk/ and notice the website's called "Wells and Young's Co."- for some reason Young's doesn't link to the same page for it's beer list.
(And, gee, why don't we get the Banana Bread Beer?<g>).

Most of the notices I read about the "deleted" labels, didn't mention the Oatmeal Stout- now I'll have to check around for some of that before it disappears.

[newportstorm]

Emailed Young's to see what's been axed, what's still brewed and what is still exported to the US. If/when I get a reply, I'll post.

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by newportstorm
Emailed Young's to see what's been axed, what's still brewed and what is still exported to the US. If/when I get a reply, I'll post.

You could also try the regional reps of the US importer, if you don't get an answer from "Wells and Young's":

http://www.belukus.net/sales.html

[steveh]

Originally posted by skahtboi
Hmm...it seems my question regarding Young's Oatmeal Stout has somehow morphed into a thread about Young's DCS.

Heh - I picked up a bottle of the OS at the same time I grabbed the DC. I'm not sure of the vintage though, stay tuned - probably get to it tomorrow night.

S.

[sundontlie]

now that i hear so much anti bubble gum opinions i'm going to have to have a few more.. maybe there was a bad batch i found myself in the middle of. This was about 5 years ago and it was overwhelmingly pink and poppy.

[sundontlie]

i'll take a look around for the OS also.

[steveh]

Originally posted by sundontlie
now that i hear so much anti bubble gum opinions

Another indication: I have a friend who hates Weizen and Wits because they have too much bubble gum and banana flavors -- he can't even get through an Aventinus. He loves the Double Choco.

I'm guessing you guys had some very old DCS.

Skahtboit - BeerAdvocate doesn't have either of the Young's Stouts listed as "retired," as they do the Dirty Dick and others.

S.

[D0nc0smic]

Originally posted by steveh
-- he can't even get through an Aventinus.
S.
Wow, poor guy, that was the beer that really made me interested i bigger more complex beers

[ratman03]

Wow, if Young's has stopped brewing Oatmeal that would be a shame. I have always considered Young's very good quality English ale in terms of what is available in the U.S.

How does the world famous Ram Brewery just close like that? Isn't there support for great ale in London?

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by ratman03

How does the world famous Ram Brewery just close like that? Isn't there support for great ale in London?

From what I've read, some of the reasons given *was* their current success and lack of room to grow, difficulty with running an industrial business in a dense, increasingly upscale, area of London with escalating real estate values, etc. Shareholder apparently were pressuring the company to sell the land and buildings (worth "100 million pounds"). Also, some articles suggested a difficulty with a steady water supply in London and antiquated equipment compared to Wells' "modern" brewery and it's "its own supply of natural mineral water".

In some ways, the same problems Yuengling in the US was facing with it's incredible growth and, since they wound up buying a brewery and building another, it's easy for us to look at this "merger" of Wells and Young's as "failure". Either way, it certainly is sad to loose such an historic brewing site.

[TrojanAnteater]

My local Beverages & More has plenty of the Young's Oatmeal stout, DC Stout in cans, and is listing DC Stout 13.2 gallon kegs as arriving in 4 days.

[skahtboi]

Originally posted by TrojanAnteater
My local Beverages & More has plenty of the Young's Oatmeal stout, DC Stout in cans, and is listing DC Stout 13.2 gallon kegs as arriving in 4 days.

Is the Oatmeal Stout in the new style bottles, or the old, pre-merger bottles? The new bottles look like the ones pictured here:

http://www.youngs.co.uk/productPage.aspx?pageID=11

[steveh]

Originally posted by skahtboi
Is the Oatmeal Stout in the new style bottles, or the old, pre-merger bottles?

Both bottles I had/have look like this one.

S.

[TrojanAnteater]

Originally posted by skahtboi
Is the Oatmeal Stout in the new style bottles, or the old, pre-merger bottles? The new bottles look like the ones pictured here:

http://www.youngs.co.uk/productPage.aspx?pageID=11

Looks like it'd be in the new bottles. I don't know what the old looked like.

Here's the picture http://www.bevmo.com/115images/10550.jpg

[stronk]

I don't know that it's as simple as old bottles-old brewery, new bottles-new brewery. Young's have been screwing around with their branding for a while now and the labels keep changing. I think at one point they had some beers in new style bottles and some in old before they even sold the Ram brewery.

The real way to tell where it was brewed is just to read the label, usually (I've still got a couple of old Gales HSBs from before Fullers bought them and they say so on the label).

[steveh]

Had the Oatmeal Stout last night - what a wonderful brew, I don't drink it too often so when I do it's always a happy reintroduction!

I checked both the OS and DCS bottles before they hit the recycle bin and they both had best by dates of July 07. Pretty good sign that the 2 styles are still in production, I'd think -- though I didn't think to look for a brewing location. There's more where they came from, though!

S.

[jesskidden]

I think Young's (like many UK/European brewers) give their beer a 1 year window in the US. I've seen a lot of Young's with "Best By' dates of August and even Sept. 2007 here in NJ, so I've always assumed that these are still from the Ram Brewery (esp. since it includes "Dirty Dick", one of the dropped beers) -where brewing stopped in Sept. '06. Most of those beers, IIRC (recycling picked up last Monday...<g>), were in the "new" bottle design as well.

I guess the question is when the Wells brewery first starting brewing the Young's beers and if the new labels in the US will show the new address and/or name "Wells and Young's".

[newportstorm]

Got a response. Told me what I already knew (no Dirty Dick's), was vague about which brands were victims of the reorganization and gave a glimmer of hope that Dick's might return?

"Dear Mike,

Many thanks for your e-mail and support of the Young's brands.

It is true that since the recent merger with Charles Wells, the company has undergone a review of all of it's SKU's and that several brands including Dirty Dicks are currently unavailable. More positively, the company is actively seeking alternative production for this brand, although at this point in time, I am unable to advise you if and when this will become available once more. My advice would be to keep updated via our US impoters Belukus. Inc.

Yours sincerely,

M.Avellano
International Sales Manager"

[steveh]

Geez. Reducing their labels to the term "SKUs" gives me no hope. That and an Englishman misusing apostrophes -- where's Richard?! ;)

S.

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by steveh
Geez. Reducing their labels to the term "SKUs" gives me no hope.

S.

I thought that was strange, too, even tho' it's pretty typical within any industry or sub-culture to develop a jargon that sounds strange to outsiders. I was reading a brewery history book and an owner keep talking about the price of a "box of beer". Not a hard one to figure out, but it still read strange.

I was somewhat shocked (well....amused) when I heard birdwatchers (who call themselves "birders" and hate the other term) use the term "unit" for a bird.

"What's that brown unit with the yellow on the breast?"

Hey, that's what we called trucks or cars during assembly in the auto industry.

"There's a unit on the final line with a loose IP."
(IP is "instrument panel", what normal people call the dashboard.)

[steveh]

Originally posted by jesskidden
I thought that was strange, too, even tho' it's pretty typical within any industry or sub-culture to develop a jargon that sounds strange to outsiders.

That's just the trouble - I don't like looking at brewing as an "industry" in the same definition that GM & Ford are industries -- too cold -- beer comes from a brewery, not a factory (then again, I guess Kraft is part of the food "industry").

I work for an industrial supplier with a huge catalog filled with "SKUs" (Stock Keeping Unit), I hate equating Young's Dbl Choco with a garbage disposal or a power drill.

S.

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by steveh
That's just the trouble - I don't like looking at brewing as an "industry" in the same definition that GM & Ford are industries -- too cold -- beer comes from a brewery, not a factory (then again, I guess Kraft is part of the food "industry").

I work for an industrial supplier with a huge catalog filled with "SKUs" (Stock Keeping Unit), I hate equating Young's Dbl Choco with a garbage disposal or a power drill.

S.

Agreed. But a sales manager's job is to sell beer. Though most undoubtedly enjoy beer, their focus is on selling, filling orders, dealing with importers/distributors, etc. I'll forgive him for speaking in such a cold manner.

Now, if a brewer ever refers to his labor of love as a SKU....

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by steveh
That's just the trouble - I don't like looking at brewing as an "industry" in the same definition that GM & Ford are industries -- too cold -- beer comes from a brewery, not a factory

S.

Oh, I agree, I agree. And I think it WAS strange for a guy from the sales side of the business to use "SKU" when he was writing to a consumer, rather than "our babies" or "WotBA" (works of the brewer's art) or even "beers" "styles" or, at worse, "our labels". I guess it just shows us that even a well-respected (in the US, anyway) brewer like Young's has as part of their business a sales oriented sub-culture.

I still like the story about Michelob going all-malt when the marketing guys announced a return to a design based vaguely on the old hour glass shape bottles and the group from the brewing part of the business (I picture them sitting way in the back of the meeting and sheepishly raising their hands...) saying, "Gee, why don't we, you know, as a gimmick, improve the beer while we're at it."
(General meeting consensis, "Well, OK, but don't go crazy with it.")

And while I sometimes cringe when the mass media calls a brewery a "beer factory", it IS a good term to use for the megabrewers and their super-efficient, automated breweries (untouched by human hands!) to distinquish them from craft brewers, just as I always sort of liked the terms "ILL" or "NAIL" for "Industrial Light Lager" or "North American Industrial lager" while the general beer geek sub-culture has settled on "BMC" or just "American Light Lager" (when not using urinary references, that is).

[fretlessman71]

Interesting how the obvious acronym for American Light Lager is.... ALL. Hmmmm... gives one pause, doesn't it? :rolleyes:

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by fretlessman71
Interesting how the obvious acronym for American Light Lager is.... ALL. Hmmmm... gives one pause, doesn't it? :rolleyes:

What, the laundry detergent? <g>

I like how, say, BA lists as "American Macro Lagers" beers from every continent -Brahma, Labatt Blue, Fosters, Corona (and most other Mexicans), Singha, Tusker, San Miguel, Peroni, Tsingtao, Victoria Bitter, etc., etc.

Why are WE blamed for them <g>? American Brewing Imperialism? Sure, we should SHARE the blame (the biggest share, possibly) but c'mon.

Or, is it based not on brewing location but destination (a la "India" Pale Ale)?

[steveh]

Originally posted by jesskidden
Corona (and most other Mexicans), Singha,

I wouldn't paint all of the (well known) Mexican brews with the same brush -- I enjoy Bohemia and Dos Eques quite often, as well as a Singha* here and there. Maybe they've found a good method of making it better? Does Singha use corn?

It's based on style -- unfortunately of which, that doesn't seem to apply to their rating system – going by the direction of some posts at one of the recent threads.

S.

*You'll note that the A Bros these, and the Bohemia and DE Amber are listed as Vienna Lagers. Just an edit.

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by steveh
Does Singha use corn?


Not according to their site:

"Singha Lager Beer:
A premium lager beer brewed from the finest ingredients, "Singha" is a full-bodied 100% barley malt beer that is distinctively rich in taste with strong hop characters."

[ratman03]

Originally posted by steveh
That's just the trouble - I don't like looking at brewing as an "industry" in the same definition that GM & Ford are industries -- too cold -- beer comes from a brewery, not a factory (then again, I guess Kraft is part of the food "industry").

I work for an industrial supplier with a huge catalog filled with "SKUs" (Stock Keeping Unit), I hate equating Young's Dbl Choco with a garbage disposal or a power drill.

S.

I'll give the benefit of the doubt that the Young's rep that Newport communicated with didn't mean it in a bad way, but your point is well taken. The real issue to me is why sales managers are communicating with the consumer; this and the fact that they immediately started axing labels (RIP Dirty Dick's) tells me all I need to know.

We've all seen this before, and all one can do is wait for the beancounters to do what they're gonna do, let the dust settle, and hope the beer still tastes ok.

As for the Ram Brewery, well that's just sad. :( Beer has been brewed on the site since 1581, and now it's going to become housing and chain stores; sounds like something that would happen in the United States.

http://www.wandsworthguardian.co.uk/display.var.778142.0.youngs_brewery_calls_time_aft er_175_years.php

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by ratman03
As for the Ram Brewery, well that's just sad. Beer has been brewed on the site since 1581, and now it's going to become housing and chain stores; sounds like something that would happen in the United States.

http://www.wandsworthguardian.co.uk/display.var.778142.0.youngs_brewery_calls_time_aft er_175_years.php

Weren't there rumblings about Cantillon moving (closing? :eek: ) last year? Jean Pierre Van Roy stated crime and congestion were making it difficult to conduct business? Hopefully, that was rumor or Mr. Van Roy simply having a down day. It's sad to lose a historical brewery building but beer made in an industrial park can taste just as good - I've visited many that are proof.

I'd eventually like to see Dirty Dick's make a return. Very few bottled Milds here in the US.

[steveh]

Originally posted by newportstorm
Not according to their site:

"Singha Lager Beer:
A premium lager beer brewed from the finest ingredients, "Singha" is a full-bodied 100% barley malt beer that is distinctively rich in taste with strong hop characters."

I then wonder why the Bros list it as an American Macro lager? No corn, no rice - what up with that? I like it when I have it at our favorite Thai restaurant - refreshing against some good Thai spice.

S.

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by steveh
I then wonder why the Bros list it as an American Macro lager? No corn, no rice - what up with that? I like it when I have it at our favorite Thai restaurant - refreshing against some good Thai spice.

S.

Who knows?

Submit a change, I guess, to All-Malt Lager.

I drink it at a local a local "Asian" restaurant that deals in many types of far eastern cuisine.

[stronk]

Beer has been brewed on the site since 1581, and now it's going to become housing and chain stores
Tell you what: when I leave university, I'll buy a flat there and home brew. I could even print 'continuous brewing on site for over 400 years' on the labels!

[MeridianFC]

Originally posted by stronk
Tell you what: when I leave university, I'll buy a flat there and home brew. I could even print 'continuous brewing on site for over 400 years' on the labels!

How's about I partner with you. Since my surname is Young............ (is that the Patent Office I hear on the phone?)

[stronk]

Well... I don't know: it's your surname, isn't it? Why shouldn't you have the right to use it to label your beer with? After all, it was made by you, right? ;)

[MeridianFC]

Young's Spesh-Ale from the Stonk & Meridian Brewery Wandsworth (Flat 3B) served at the Human Head Pub.

The first all Realbeer.com business venture. Chaz, where's the checkbook?

[jesskidden]

Thought I'd resurrect this thread, since I just saw Young's Oatmeal Stout on the shelf in NJ in a store where it was previously sold out. Still in the same "Ram" bottle, and the label still read only "Young's" and "Ram Brewery" *BUT* the "Best By" date was April, 2008 which implies it was brewed in 2007 (they give their beers 1 year- for the US market, anyway).

Confusingly, it was next to another Young's beer where the label read "Wells and Young's" and the "Best By" date was May, 2008 (ie, so they were most likely exported at the same time). Also, tho' the label had a space for the date, it was actually printed right on the bottle itself. (Which I hate, because those can often be "rubbed off" by distributors/retailers).

Checked the website of the US importer again, and they've updated their listings (they now carry the Wells Bombardier and Banana Bread beers as well) and they seem to imply that the Oatmeal Stout is brewed for export to the US only and is available in the UK only at the "Brewery Tap", which might explain why the Young's and Wells and Young's websites don't mention Oatmeal Stout.

http://www.belukus.net/product.asp?p=you_oatmeal

Interestingly, they also still list "Dirty Dick's", another beer thought to be lost in the merger. I didn't see any of that on the shelf in NJ.

"So...", I guess some might be thinking, "...how does the "new" Oatmeal Stout taste?"

I didn't buy any (we're in the middle of a heat wave in NJ)- spent my money of 4 more bottles of the Schneider & Brooklyner Hopfen-Weisse. Man, this is a great summer "night cap" beer- I even found a nice Sam Adams branded weisse beer glass I had that had been banished to the cellar "overstock" area for it.

[steveh]

Originally posted by jesskidden
and they seem to imply that the Oatmeal Stout is brewed for export to the US

I thought that's always been true, since the late 90s or so. Or maybe it was only the Double Chocolate? Either case, I saw fresh bottles and cans of the Dbl Choco at Trader Joe's last week, but as you said -- it's not exactly Stout season.

S.

[newportstorm]

Any season is stout season.

Killed a bomber of Smuttynose Imperial Stout 2 nights ago.
Quite refreshing.

[jesskidden]

Originally posted by steveh
I thought that's always been true, since the late 90s or so. Or maybe it was only the Double Chocolate?
S.

Was it? Sounds familar now that you mention it. I can't keep straight which UK beers are the same in the US and UK, and which labels are made just for the US or reformulated for the US market. (I guess my brain's too full of all that Heileman-Stroh-Pabst-Falstaff trivia <g> to have room for the UK stuff, too.)

I do recall that some of Samuel Smith's beers are (or were) "for export to the US" only, including IIRC their Oatmeal Stout and Porter.

I'm still trying to remember who's brewing the US bottled and kegged Bass Ale for InBev, now that the contract with Coors ended. I know the Marston's brewed Draught Bass is getting a positive reaction in the UK but the Bass we get is still rather insipid, isn't it? (Suppose I could check the label next time I'm in a store, but that's never as much fun as speculation.)

[steveh]

Originally posted by jesskidden
Was it? Sounds familar now that you mention it.

I only remember because, on my only trip to London in the late 90s, our last stop of the trip was to a Young's house, and my last beer of the trip was an Oatmeal Stout...which I should have been drinking the whole trip! And then a few years later I heard (from Richard?) that it wasn't available in the UK anymore.

Newport, it's 88° in Chicago right now, 96° heat index, 61% humidity -- trust me, that is not Stout weather. Pilsner anyone?

S.

[newportstorm]

Originally posted by steveh
Newport, it's 88° in Chicago right now, 96° heat index, 61% humidity -- trust me, that is not Stout weather. Pilsner anyone?


Call me when it breaks 100.
Probably still won't agree. ;)

Have my eye on some Harpoon Kellerbier for week's end, though.

[skahtboi]

Originally posted by newportstorm
Any season is stout season.



I couldn't agree more.


Here in Texas we are routinely faced with near 100 temps and high humidity, and I find a beer like YOS to bea very refreshing beer. Of course, I do tend to drink more Pilsners, such as Prima Pils and SN Summer Stock in the summer than anything. I thnk with me it is more of a what mood am I in kind of thing.

Heck...last night as I was grilling I was drinking nothing but American Pale Ales. (Sierra Nevada, Dundee's, and Santa Fe.)