Feeling a bit bored.

[cattersley]

I have been out and about at the beer store, and the LCBO. I havent come across anything, and I mean anything new for beer drinkers in Ontario. I am feeling a bit of the winter 'blahs', and have been wanting, actually craving something new to try. I have yet to come across anything interesting, and for that matter, any new! So, anyone out there in Ontario find something interesting, new, anything, and where to find it... Please. I would love to no.

- cattersley

[BigE]

I just picked up a couple of the Fuller's 2006 Vintage Ale ($8 a bottle at the LCBO). The label says the longer it sits the better it'll get and I plan to let it sit until our new house is built this fall. I also grabbed a couple of the Innis and Gunn 2006 Oak Aged Limited Edition, man it was good almost like sipping on a good whiskey!!!

As for mainstream stuff, try the stuff from Mill St. a Toronto brewery available at the beer store and LCBO, I love their Coffee Porter and their Tankhouse Ale is excellent!

[cattersley]

That is cool that you mentioned Fullers, and Innis & Gunn, I baught both, and am aging them as well.

I can't wait to try them now~! Cheers.

- cattersley.

[markaberrant]

I just grabbed a bottle of Fuller's too (had to go to Alberta for it).

Unibroue 16 was just released, and is available in Canada, which is a first for their "anniversary" special.

[BigE]

Originally posted by cattersley
That is cool that you mentioned Fullers, and Innis & Gunn, I baught both, and am aging them as well.

I can't wait to try them now~! Cheers.

- cattersley.

The Innis & Gunn really impressed me. I was in London Ontario a few months ago at this place that was supposed to have a huge beer selection, they brought me out this big book but not much caught my eye...except the Innis & Gunn...of course they didn;t have any so I had a Guinness. A friend of mine bought the Innis from the LCBO and we had it that day, I really enjoyed it...and have never had anything like it. As much as a love beer I also love a good whiskey and the Innis & Gunn was like sipping on a good whiskey, the flavours were excellent and it packed a punch! I'm definitely gonna grab a few more!

[cattersley]

I picked up the Innis & Gunn today, and I have a friend that will be in Quebec in a week that is going to look for the Unibroue 16. He is also pick me up a Boreale mix pack.

Oh, while in Quebec everyone there is a great brewery in Blainville, Les Brasseurs Du Nord that make the Boreale line of beers. I hit two places religiously while in Quebec, la Belle Provance for a couple of steamer's & poutine, and a Super C or IGA to pick up a mix pack of Boreale.

http://www.boreale.com/

If anyone out there from Quebec has any hints on where to look please reply so I can direct him where to go... (The SAQ, IGA.. etc)

Cheers all!

regards, cattersley.

[Richard English]

Innis and Gunn will not mature much in the bottle as it is not bottle-conditioned. Fuller's Vintage (and 1845) will develop over the months or even years.

[HogieWan]

Originally posted by Richard English
Innis and Gunn will not mature much in the bottle as it is not bottle-conditioned. Fuller's Vintage (and 1845) will develop over the months or even years.

even if it's not bottle conditioned, it WILL age and change character.

[Richard English]

Of course. Everything changes. But the process is different for a brewery-conditioned beer than it is for a bottle-conditioned beer. The brewery-conditioned beer is sterile, having been filtered (and in some case pasteurised). Its change will inevitably be a gradual deterioration since there is no possibility of any regeneration.

But bottle-conditioned beer is like a fine wine or vintage champagne. There are still fermentable solids left and these will slowly ferment and add a complexity of character that won't happen with the sterile product.

If you check you will find that the "best-before" date (I am assuming that such dates are used in Canada as they are in the UK) is later for bottle-conditioned beer than it is for brewery-conditioned beer. Highly processed beers (Dudweiser and its clones) have very short shelf-lives; fine bottle-conditioned beers like Fuller's Vintage and Thomas Hardy's Ale will mature for years.

[HogieWan]

Originally posted by Richard English
Of course. Everything changes. But the process is different for a brewery-conditioned beer than it is for a bottle-conditioned beer. The brewery-conditioned beer is sterile, having been filtered (and in some case pasteurised). Its change will inevitably be a gradual deterioration since there is no possibility of any regeneration.

But bottle-conditioned beer is like a fine wine or vintage champagne. There are still fermentable solids left and these will slowly ferment and add a complexity of character that won't happen with the sterile product.

If you check you will find that the "best-before" date (I am assuming that such dates are used in Canada as they are in the UK) is later for bottle-conditioned beer than it is for brewery-conditioned beer. Highly processed beers (Dudweiser and its clones) have very short shelf-lives; fine bottle-conditioned beers like Fuller's Vintage and Thomas Hardy's Ale will mature for years.

actually, brewery conditioned beer isn't necessarily filtered. After the beer is naturally conditioned and the majority of the yeast is settled, the beer can be bottled under pressure and retain it's natural conditioning without filtering anything out.

I don't know how Innis and Gunn condition or package their peer, but to say that just because something is not bottle conditioned, it can't mature with age is just silly.

That said, most beers meant for aging are bottle conditioned.

[Richard English]

Originally posted by HogieWan
actually, brewery conditioned beer isn't necessarily filtered. After the beer is naturally conditioned and the majority of the yeast is settled, the beer can be bottled under pressure and retain it's natural conditioning without filtering anything out.

I don't know how Innis and Gunn condition or package their peer, but to say that just because something is not bottle conditioned, it can't mature with age is just silly.

That said, most beers meant for aging are bottle conditioned.

Innis and Gunn is brewery-conditioned and thus carbonated (as is all brewery-conditioned beer) by external carbon-dioxide. To be bottle-conditioned a beer must have unfermented solids left so that it can ferment and generate carbon dioxide. Otherwise it would be flat.

[HogieWan]

Originally posted by Richard English
Innis and Gunn is brewery-conditioned and thus carbonated (as is all brewery-conditioned beer) by external carbon-dioxide. To be bottle-conditioned a beer must have unfermented solids left so that it can ferment and generate carbon dioxide. Otherwise it would be flat.

as a homebrewer, I understand bottle conditioning. However, a lot of brewer's condition the whole batch at once by either sealing the tank at a certain gravity, or adding a measured amount of fermentables to the whole batch and sealing it. This works like a big, batch-sized bottle. The yeast ferment the sugar, give off co2 that, in-turn carbonates the beer, and then settle to the bottom. The difference is that it is bottled through a sealed system that keeps the natural carbonation, but leaves the yeast out of the bottle.

I've done similar at home. I''ve primed a whole keg of homebrew and then (after the conditioning and settle finish) poured the beer from the tap to a bottle. I DID use a co2 bottle to push the beer out (so no longer "real ale"), but it did carbonated naturally and that's good enough for me at home.

Even though bottle conditioned beers tend to last longer, if the yeast die, they add some really funky flavors and aromas to the beer.

as I said, innis and gunn may very well force carbonated their beer - I've never had any of their wares.

[Richard English]

I've drunk Innis and Gunn and it's an OK beer. But it's not bottle conditioned.

I have never tasted any "off" flavours from bottle-conditioned beers (or for that matter, Champagnes). Of course, the choice of yeast matters; in my tyro home-brewing days I didn't realise this and used bakers' yeast. It took me quite a while to realise that yeasts do vary! Mind you, that was about 45 years ago...

[HogieWan]

Originally posted by Richard English
I've drunk Innis and Gunn and it's an OK beer. But it's not bottle conditioned.

It is rare, but it has happened

I didn't mean to offend if I did - just playing a bit of devil's advocate.

I do have a question for you. How do you feel about Sierra Nevada's bottling practice? They beers are bottle conditioned, but they are first filtered and then blended with actively fermenting beer to provide the fermentables and to replace the yeast that was filtered out.

[Richard English]

This seems to me to be krausening, as sometimes used for proper lagers and wheat beers. More information here http://www.picobrewery.com/askarchive/krausen.htm

Certainly Sierra Nevada is a fine drink so the system seems to work OK for its lightish style. For fuller-bodied ales, though, it's probably not needed.

[Cass]

I was in a LCBO here in Ottawa the other day (not the usual LCBO I go too, this was a few blocks away) and they were selling a beer by the name of Heritage I believe... Just 6 packs of course since its the lcbo, but I saw that it was brewed in Ottawa. Haven't tried it yet, didn't pick any up that day, was the first I saw it. I think theres a beaver in front of a maple leaf (kinda like the nickel symbol) on the box. Anyone ever see or try this beer? As I said, never seen it anywhere else.

Cass

[cattersley]

Yes, I have tried there beers. Picked them up at the LCBO on the Lake Shore in Toronto. Both are good, but the dark lager was the better of the two. Cheers!

- cattersley.