Red Ale turns out Brown?

[thekulman]

Tried my first AG ‘Red Ale’ last night. It was good, although not enough CO2 after only 1 week bottle conditioning. …but it wasn’t Red, more brown – like a Newcastle Brown Ale.

I used 10 lbs 2 row and ½ cup (2 oz?) roasted barley, mashed at 152 F, boiled with 2 oz of 4.1 AAU Kent Goldings for 60 min, pitched Wyeast Irish Ale liquid yeast.

I only have small pots so I boiled 3 gallons in 1 and 2 1/4 gallons in the other, adding an oz. of hops in each.

Here’s my theory – because I didn’t have a big enough pot for the full 6 gallons, I threw out the last gallon or so of lautered wort. That last bit would have been the lightest wort and lightened my colour, so I collected only the darkest part of the wort. Probably also why my OG was 1.059.

Don’t get me wrong – probably the best beer I’ve made – but it’s not Red Ale.

Am I on the right track with my thinking? If I make this again and collect the full 6 gallons, will it be red as opposed to brown?

Kul

[HogieWan]

My red ale is more brown than red, but it does have a bit of red to it.

However, the first people to taste it said - "Hey this beer is red!" To which my reply was - "Yeah, that's why it;s called a RED ale."

[thekulman]

Originally posted by HogieWan
My red ale is more brown than red, but it does have a bit of red to it.

However, the first people to taste it said - "Hey this beer is red!" To which my reply was - "Yeah, that's why it;s called a RED ale."

HogieWan;

What was your recipe? And I notice your caption says you like dry yeast, how come?

[HogieWan]

Originally posted by thekulman
HogieWan;

What was your recipe? And I notice your caption says you like dry yeast, how come?

My recipe is here (http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11539)

I like dry yeast because I get good flavor profiles from the ones I've used, much shorter lags times, much shorter/easier prep (no starters) and the cost is less than 25% of the liquid stuff.

[markaberrant]

Originally posted by thekulman
Tried my first AG ‘Red Ale’ last night. It was good, although not enough CO2 after only 1 week bottle conditioning. …but it wasn’t Red, more brown – like a Newcastle Brown Ale.

I used 10 lbs 2 row and ½ cup (2 oz?) roasted barley, mashed at 152 F, boiled with 2 oz of 4.1 AAU Kent Goldings for 60 min, pitched Wyeast Irish Ale liquid yeast.


Kul, my guess is you are using too much roasted barley. Use brewing software to formulate your recipes, then you can make sure your SRM value is in the right range.

Roasted Barley used in the right amount should give you a red colour. My plan for an Irish Red is to use 2 lbs of CaraRed and a bit of RB (I'm not on my computer with my brewing software to give an exact amount).

[BigEd]

The half cup of roasted barley, which is closer to 3 or 4 oz, is your problem. That quantity is going to make a brown beer. Although I think "red" ale is just marketing BS that began when Coor's bought the Killian's name years ago if you want to make a brew red use just a little black malt in the grist. One or two tablespoons or about 3/4 ounce should do the trick. Roasted barley will give that vaguely "Irish" flavor that hints of a bit a stout but chocolate or black patent will also work.

[thekulman]

I'm going to try again but plan something like this;

8 lbs 2 row malt
.5 lbs medium carmel malt (60 L?)
.5 lbs carapils malt
2 oz (using a scale, not a measuring cup) roasted barley

and only 1 oz hop (Kent Golding) for 60 min.

I'll through this in Promash and see what happens.

[markaberrant]

Originally posted by thekulman
I'm going to try again but plan something like this;

8 lbs 2 row malt
.5 lbs medium carmel malt (60 L?)
.5 lbs carapils malt
2 oz (using a scale, not a measuring cup) roasted barley

and only 1 oz hop (Kent Golding) for 60 min.

I'll through this in Promash and see what happens.

The caramel malt will not provide a red colour, and the finish would be more sweet, instead of dry, which is what you want in an Irish Red.

Get some CaraRed (for colouring) if you can, otherwise stick to your base malt, roasted barley (for dryness and colouring) and a highly attenuative yeast for a dry finish.

[brewmonkey]

Originally posted by markaberrant
The caramel malt will not provide a red colour, and the finish would be more sweet, instead of dry, which is what you want in an Irish Red.

Get some CaraRed (for colouring) if you can, otherwise stick to your base malt, roasted barley (for dryness and colouring) and a highly attenuative yeast for a dry finish.

CaraRed may add some color but it too is a crystal malt and just like CaraPils® it will add sweetness to the beer.

The best way to get color is to use very low amounts of higher kilned malts unless residual sweetness is desired, in which case you obviously get your color from higher lovibond Crystal malts.

[markaberrant]

Originally posted by brewmonkey
CaraRed may add some color but it too is a crystal malt and just like CaraPils® it will add sweetness to the beer.

The best way to get color is to use very low amounts of higher kilned malts unless residual sweetness is desired, in which case you obviously get your color from higher lovibond Crystal malts.

From what I've been told, CaraRed is similar in flavour to Crystal 20, but more malty/toasty.

I was doing some reading this morning on colour, and one chart says that reddish-brown/copper is around 14-17 SRM, and BJCP guidelines for Irish Ale is 9-18 SRM, so that should give you something to shoot for.

[Mill Rat]

Get a brewing software package (promash, et al) and plug your recipe ideas into it. You don't need to take everything it spits out as gospel, but it will give you a reasonably close prediction on OG, color, and bitterness. It might not have predicted your red ale color spot-on, but it would have let you know that you had too much roasted malt for the brew to anything lighter than brown.

[thekulman]

I put my recipe above through promash and it works out great. The colour is on the lighter side of the range for red, as are the IBUs. The reason I wanted to add crystal and carapils was for head retention reasons.

[Bilbo Beergins]

Originally posted by BigEd
Although I think "red" ale is just marketing BS that began when Coor's bought the Killian's name years ago if you want to make a brew red use just a little black malt in the grist.

I've had a few red ales over the years before Coors got into it. It's a pleasant view to see that hue, shining through the dimmed light of a pub.

Dittoes on the advice, which has been proven by the bros. who offer it.