alternative to kits

[croc4]

I asked the owner of the local hb store about an alternative to liquid extract, he said that he would never use liquid extract because it is inferior to dry.

So I assume that I could use all dry extract instead?

So why do people use the liquid extracts?

I have used them becase they came with the kits I bought (brewers best).

I thought at first you needed them, but it would appear that you don't, the draw back that I can see is that you would have to build up a flavor profile from scratch...

Any other reasons for using liquid extract?

[danno]

either one works fine. I've actually never used a canned extract, but I've often used the quart and half gallon private label LME from both Northern Brewer and Midwest Supplies. They claim, (and I have no reason to doubt them) that the LME is very fresh as they turn their inventory quite rapidly. But I've brewed fine beer with both LME and DME.

I think both are kinda of a PITA (pain in the ...) to deal with, LME can take forever to pour out of the container, and the steam from your boil causes the DME to stick to the package...

[YamahaXS]

yeah, don't put too much stock into your LHB guy's opinion...its still just an opinion.


DME is stronger, so for pound for pound you need less of it (6 pounds of DME makes a FINE BEER! :D)

DME gets disolved faster, I think is less likely to scorch, BUT is very sensitive to humidity.

Liquid Malt extract is more common. Its cheaper. Its sometimes hopped. Its pretty easy to work with. Keep O2 off of it and it should last for quite some time.

anyways, try some DME. it is nice, but I still fluctuate b/t the two types.

[toneyc]

The little experience that I've had with DME is that it is a PITA to work with. It clots up really bad, sinks to the bottom, scorches into black flakes, ug, you guys can keep it! (Insert smiley here) (Why can't you have more than one smiley in a post??) Is lighter colored beer an advantage? Not enough to put up with the mess, I think. It is kinda nice to make starters with, though, which is my only source of experience with it so take that for what it's worth.

:)
Toney.

[paul84043]

There must have been a time that Liquid Extract really sucked, I hear alot of people bitch about it, but my personal experience is that it is very good quality and makes great tasting beer.

[mcarlson74]

I have to agree with Toney on this one. I am not a big fan of DME. I have used both and prefere LME. Everytime that I have use DME he has created this hard crust on the top of my wort which eventually goes away throughout the boil. I think to be honest with you it is really all just preference. ;)

[croc4]

Thanks everyone.

I can relate to the problems seen with DME and the steam rising from the kettle.

I think for my next batch I will try only DME to see how it turns out, As far as cost goes, for me it is a "little" cheaper to go with DME. The LME costs me 14.95 for 3.75lbs, and the DME is 3.50 a lb.

[wortchillergoal]

In terms of flavor and quality I think both are the same. I have used both, sometimes together. I use DME most of the time as I find it easier to work with. Unlike another reply I find I have a hard time keeping the LME from sinking and carmelizing. They both have pros and cons, work with what you like, in this great hobby there are many right way to do things. Beer can be food, but food can never be beer.

[sallad]

from my local shop, LME only comes in a few size cans- about 4lbs or 1.4lb kickers. so, if i'm aiming for a certain OG, its kinda hard to do that with LME, unless i want to waste a pound or two of extract. i find that DME stores more easily. if i buy a 3lb bag and use half of it, i can store the rest for the next batch.

although, i'm more partial to partial mashes these days for that extra kick.. 4lbs of LME and a couple lbs of grain for that added bit a fermentables!

i do still keep about 1lb of DME on hand for priming!

[paul84043]

I typically keep a 3 or 4 pound bag of DME in the cupboard for making starters, priming, and giving a weak batch a bit more kick...

[mmmBeer...]

I usually use DME, I just find it easier then LME to use. I also like it because I can buy a lot of it and store it in the basement. However, I don’t have enough room in my fridge for that much LME. My local only stocks LME that they have bought in bulk and repackaged, so it needs to be kept cold.

Plus DME up here comes in 1 Kg packages so 3 kilos is 6.6 pounds perfect for one batch!

[Payson]

I prefer DME to liquid because I feel it is far less apt to stick to the bottom of the pot and scorch. Here's the trick: Once water comes to a boil, remove the brewpot from the heat and add the DME. Stir until it dissolves and place pot back on the heat. I've never had it scorch using this method. Other than that and convenience in storage, I don't notice any appreciable difference in taste.

[S.F.B.]

I have come to like using dry over syrup. Ease of use is one of the reasons. I prefer the lighter color that the dry produces. I have nothing negative to say about extract syrups. I used them for a couple of years with no problems. Just not for me any more.

[Fast_Eddy]

Originally posted by Payson
I prefer DME to liquid because I feel it is far less apt to stick to the bottom of the pot and scorch. Here's the trick: Once water comes to a boil, remove the brewpot from the heat and add the DME. Stir until it dissolves and place pot back on the heat. I've never had it scorch using this method. Other than that and convenience in storage, I don't notice any appreciable difference in taste.

DME or LME it is strongly suggested to remove the heat while you're adding it and stirring it in.

[yonkersbrewer]

All these problems with scorching and clotting sounds like you all need some kitchen tips more than a discussion about LME vs. DME.

A couple of great tools to have for cooking & brewing. The first is a flame tamer. It is a piece of heavy cast iron that you put between the stove flames and the pot bottom. It makes you pot have a thick bottom that is less likely to scorch. A couple of bucks and it is used all the time in my house to avoid scorching the beer/sauce/hot chocolate etc.

A good quality cooks wisk. You won't get the same mixing ability with your spoon that you will with a wisk. The multiple wires cut through the water and powder or syrup and makes mixing much easier. Since it is at the beginning of boil you have no worries about sterilization.

A big Pyrex measuring cup - 2 cups at least in size. Put your DME in that to pour into the pot. When/if it gets clumpy from the steam just rinse the measuring cup in the wort and take your wisk and stir it all in.

[fretlessman71]

The directions on my can of LME say to remove the label and place in a pan of very hot water for about 15-20 minutes to soften it up. Is everyone here doing that? Wouldn't that make it easier for it to dissolve and NOT stick to the bottom and scorch?

[BigRed]

Though Ive only made 2 batches of beer, I prefer LME. Soaking the can in hot water does help, and if the LME your using the comes in plastic jugs, when your done pouring you can dip the jug down in the hot wort to get the rest of the LME out. On my first batch I used dry and I ended up stirring for 20 minutes before I was able to stick it back on the burner.

[Jeff]

Fret,

I always take the cans and place in a pan of water on a burner set to warm or low. You will find that the liquid will pour straight out this way. LME is like pancake syrup straight out of the fridge it is almost solid with a little warmth it is easy to work with. I don't even remove the label anymore.

[b3s]

Originally posted by croc4
Any other reasons for using liquid extract?

because 6# of dme costs about $22 and will yield a gravity of approximately 1.055 depending on brand and ppg while 7# of lme costs about $18 and will yield a similar gravity?

that said, i use dme when doing extract...it's easier to save leftovers from.

[Brownbeard]

In most batches, I have used both. I don't think there is a lot of difference, excepts you will get lighter colors with DME. I always turn of the flame on the turkey fryer before putting the extract in, get it mixed up good, then bring it back to a boil. I have not had any scorching yet.

[evilredlight]

My LHBS sells a LME that is either
1. 5 gallons in a plastic bag like a camping water storage
all you have to do is dump it into primary and add yeast $30
2. 2.5 gallons in a metalized plastic bag inside a box, like wine $18 add 2.5 gallons of water and yeast
3. cans that are not quite liquid and you have to add alot of water and yeast $15

I buy the 2.5 gallon extracts and i cut up the metalized bags to make carboy covers. It is a win win situation.
also all the prices are in Canadian Dollars
so more like $15, $9, $7 respectivly.

[GunNut76]

Originally posted by BigRed
On my first batch I used dry and I ended up stirring for 20 minutes before I was able to stick it back on the burner.

I use DME and have never had to stir that long. The way I do it is first I get a whirl-pool going just as the water comes to a boil. Then I'll pour the 2 lb bag in really quickly, it minimizes the clumping on/in the bag, and stir with a whisk or slender spoon. I don't worry about O2 at this point because it just gets boiled right back out. Just my 2.

[mortong]

Originally posted by evilredlight
My LHBS sells a LME that is either
1. 5 gallons in a plastic bag like a camping water storage
all you have to do is dump it into primary and add yeast $30
2. 2.5 gallons in a metalized plastic bag inside a box, like wine $18 add 2.5 gallons of water and yeast
3. cans that are not quite liquid and you have to add alot of water and yeast $15

I buy the 2.5 gallon extracts and i cut up the metalized bags to make carboy covers. It is a win win situation.
also all the prices are in Canadian Dollars
so more like $15, $9, $7 respectivly.

Everything's pre-mixed in the top two kits? Do you boil everything and add hops, or just dump it into the fermenter as is?

[evilredlight]

My LHBS sells a LME that is either
1. 5 gallons in a plastic bag like a camping water storage
all you have to do is dump it into primary and add yeast $30
2. 2.5 gallons in a metalized plastic bag inside a box, like wine $18 add 2.5 gallons of water and yeast
3. cans that are not quite liquid and you have to add alot of water and yeast $15

I think both are worts that haven't been reduced so much, the top 5 gallons is an all-grain that is produced by someone local and the second is english it says not to boil just add water and yeast. I just dump it into the fermenter as it is

Everything's pre-mixed in the top two kits? Do you boil everything and add hops, or just dump it into the fermenter as is?

I have not tried the top but i think it needs to be boiled and hops need to be added, so you get the control of hopping your beer without the control of mashing, I have heard it is really good and really fresh! I think it is made in Cape Breton, NS. but I'm not sure

[evilredlight]

I think I just had the same revelation that CROC4 had.

I thought the next jump from Kits was to All grain.
I didn't realize that DME was used to build your own worts!
I don't know what I thought DME was for
It is like a whole universe has just opened up to me!

Thank you
thank you
thank You

I am so happy now, I could drink a beer!